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This setup could only really work as a second bakery that handles pies outside of mutton, hands down. It was very easy to roll out a bunch of baskets of pies and get them ready for a fire and fire both boxes. In this setup after thought, two people can easily go at it because you can cook from both the top part of the oven and the bottom. The only thing I would change to make it be able to pump out more would be to do 5x4 and two boxes on each side, each person would have two boxes to pull out of and bake, only ever needing to move one tile. You could then also store bucket of water in the production row. Another interesting note, because of the small size there was less free tiles. Even when it would be cluttered by someone, it only took moving a few items to get back to normal.

Since it's a second bakery, needing its own personal wood supply (the tiles south of the wall were free always so you could spill out down there when plating heavy or for few kindling. There is a permanent fire 8 tiles away with a shaft next to it, why waste space to store it in house. You aren't the main food source, you are supplying yum to those that are conscious of it, and dealing with the side effect of heavy rabbit trapping for clothes and packs. After this experience I think there is merit to having a second small scale bakery to handle pies if you are actively hunting rabbits. Either that or maybe skin the rabbit and just bring back the fur because damn those stack up fast.

I think doing top left corner oven and top row boxes would be great,you could set three rows of plates. The oven was there and I never thought to move it, i think was the original bakery, we just put walls around it in my gen. I really liked having two baking spaces too on top of the organization of the smaller size. Someone was actively hunting tons of rabbits so everyone had clothes and packs, but it lead to tons of rabbits piling up, and it would be too many pies for one space because there was also a fricken crap ton of mutton around too. I am gonna to try setting up rabbit stations again like that, just small little guy, makes others more likely to pursue rabbits as well.

I would agree that it shouldn't be a free ticket either, and I also agree it was too common beforehand. As a player to have some sort of control over this happening does not sound appealing. I don't want this to happen whenever I want it to, or every other life. I wish for the chance that maybe one in five or ten lives or more, it could happen if the cards were right.

Very solid points. Sometimes it feels like a generational game of hot potato because of the ratio of producers (typically experienced players) vs consumers (berry patch kids). But that would definitely be the half finished part right there. When you have a good one and get to die of old age saying goodbye and good luck, it does feel good. I always have always looked at it as reincarnation though, with the smaller playerbase, a lot of us play with each other often just without knowing. I don't know if I would lose that feeling if once in awhile when I hit reborn I saw familiar surroundings. It has already happened plenty with playing, taking a break and playing later in the evening after my ban and finding out the town is still going. I am excited to be there, but not betting on getting a third chance, or even wanting it.

So subjective, I enjoy OHOL more than most of those titles (never played rust or will) because of the lack of permanence, it keeps it fresh, and as you said you have to think about your commitment to another hour. After back to back old age deaths I almost always end up taking a break in some way, even if it's just strolling through the web or watching a video, two hours is a perfect intermission. I realize my desires and that of many of us, do in fact go against your vision. I have thought of many many ways to appease both sides, but ultimately whatever you decide, I would still be happy. Its a fun game, and a very curious one. There is so much potential within, to me almost bursting at the seams.

Jason, have you ever thought about having different servers that behave slightly differently? Immediately I think about the splitting the already smaller player base up issue, but it would be neat to something Like 1 Big Server Standard, Big Biome Map, 1.5hr Lineage ban server, then few for solo play or relief if big server 1 was bogged down.

All of this because of fricken twin eve and quad eve?!? Just change how lineages are handing when being Twin/Trip/Quad eves for the love of god. They are called TWINS ~ same family. They should have never had seperate lineages to begin with. Also Jason directly stated he always wanted multi family towns and that's in the gutter right now.

I usually immediately start making a pen when I start into a new town. I will go dig up and break up the rocks as a 3-5yr old and ask an adult to haul them to where the pen is going to be and then cut them into bell bases, unless the area calls for an adobe pen that you can do solo. Having an older adult moving the stone while youngster cuts them and places the stakes can speed things along. The village won't last long unless sheep is secured for compost, only downside is when nobody else is making food or managing the bushes while you are doing said project. I was in a town last night that I swear was the worst I have ever seen. Two bear caves within 8 tiles of the berry farm, a fast road going right between the forge and adjacent to the berry bushes. This was also like a 20 tile fast road for no reason at all, Multiple people started working on it when there was no carrots being managed for seed and only 9 berry bushes. It was like watching an eve camp put a gun to their head, not slowly starve out.

It's also not just making what we do harder, it makes certain things not viable at all and they will never be done. Pine walls are an example, 5 rope per wall is absolutely insane, and pine doors are only ever thought about because they can't lock. Even a 2x2 room would take 60 rope which would be a staggering 240-480 bowls of soil, 240 water and about 5 steel hoe. For a 2x2 room... Yeah i'd rather use 24 adobe and call it a day, Granted 4 long shafts per pine wall is also not very good, but definitely think rope is holding that back.

use the BB code img tags. Best way is to host the image on imgur, once uploaded they give you links for many different formats including BB code ( will say for forums and message boards. Simply copy that link and past it into your post or comment and it will show up.

I could totally see a nomad lineage making it. You gear up backpacks on people and carry bunch of rope. When you come upon a settlement give them iron and use their tools and cart up like 8 carts using all your rope, eventually get some horses going. Kill wild mouflon as you go and collect mutton and wild wheat, ovens are two adobe so easy to do a pit stop every 20-30 min and bake up a few carts of pies and keep going. People mostly would just eat on the go, if you are crossing enough ground living off burdock, carrots, berries, bananas and onions isn't far fetched even for a group of 20 people. The thing is though, all you are doing is surviving at the point. I can see the appeal of seeing how far a lineage like that could go (caravan leader succession would be big role) or the appeal of just doing something new. I personally would think it would be really cool to give it a shot, but it would take some coordination to get going, but once systems are in place public spawns could fall into the grooves and keep it turning for awhile. Being able to carry as much with you as possible is huge, so would need carts and horse carts fast.

I have always had a problem with rope. It is really damn expensive to make and it gets exhausted naturally fairly quickly. Cultivating it takes a fair bit of soil and water which during food shortages not advised. Often will see people make stone hoes when there is plenty of skewers around which is a real drag.

My idea:
Wild Milkweed
4/per rope as is right now
Harvest is the stalk

Cultivated Milkweed
2/per rope
Harvest is thread

Starting off would be the same, but when you start to grow it gets a little cheaper to use.

I'd argue that with fed shorn sheep producing dung its not as big of a deal, you just slightly slow down mutton production for a sec. I think previously the aim to shearing all the sheep was to stop compost cycle, well it doesn't anymore so eventually that will stop being a thing when they catch on.

I love how you consider someone being pissy over a kill is fair game, and follow that point up with, it can look like a killing spree but i always have a reason. Its actually quite deviously hilarious. On the concept of rightful murder and the crowd reaction, well anyone not using the zoom mod can barely ever see whats said by others. Almost always have no clue what is going on. It's a highly dramatic situation especially if the victims are typing with all the red on the screen. You throw out a curse because you almost never use them, and this is what they are supposed to be for right? I mean you killed somebody, I should CURSE you right? Other people are... No one curses the idiots because of the stigma, the base word is already aggressive. Some kid keeps hiding tools or flat rocks from the forge, in a relative setting you'd be yelling at the kid shame on you, not I curse you child! Curses and murders are intertwined heavily and it would be hard to step away from that without reworking the system and potentially changing up donkey town. Sending some dingus to donkeytown for an hour by themselves when they are just starting to learn the game would kill off playerbase, if meant for brickheads picking all the carrots meant for seed, once per life maybe not enough etcetera.

I do agree that most get too involved and don't just let it be. To me its kind of "Bro we are surrounded by a ring of bones of a mothers and brothers and sons. People die every minute or more, just let it be, keep an eye on them, they might be cool.  The drama we surround it with is what is drawing people to murder. Just yesterday someone started killing  people and tried to get a rise. The three left afterwards didn't really care and just kept working. When I told the person Nobody ever cared when they said they killed my mother, thats when I started seeing more colorful language. I have also been in a circumstance that someone just whipped out a knife and started coming at me. I was dodging them no problem, but explaining the situation was exactly possible. In the first circumstance we should have gotten rid of that person way earlier, in the second, I put that person down instantly, only got two curses. These examples are easier to define, one being cause and effect to their crime, the other being self defense. The gray area is when you are both judge and executioner, defining what is idiotic and delivering the killing blow. Thats the slippery slope that makes us vilify murder in my opinion.

Agreed if they spanned multiple tiles it would be an upgrade but not many objects function that way and it would not be very intuitive. Newcommen blocks two tiles because it NEEDS to reserve that spare tile for the machinery. At the moment fences just use so much. Two long shafts, adze use and shovel use. To take them out all it takes is a mallet (usually should have but if not +1 adze use) and a shovel. It's a griefers paradise, not only are the tools needed to break it down usually right around, but you can open the pen AND ding the shovel up a little bit. Oh and if there is no stakes around you need +1 long shafts (granted it is returned on use but still necessary to start it off). Considering how little guarantee there is that the pen you spent most of your life and a bunch of resources to make is gonna last an hour or so, why do fancy? Considering how viable oven base pens are to me bell tower bases are fancy, especially if there are a lot of reed stumps to dig up to get it off the ground. I would never conceive of even starting to use a fence to make a pen, no way in an average camp is there going to be enough shafts to get it done in a timely manner. Also if I were spawning into a city and there was time for that and perhaps resources - the pen is already too established and there isn't room. It would be absolutely pointless to attempt said project, your best bet realistically is to convert a oven base pen into adobe wall pen. Which again is rather pointless because the pen works, and there is other stuff that could be done. When is the last time you saw someone grief an oven base pen anyways? A single bucket of water and a bowl and you could take down half the pen in seconds and collapse the town - yet for some reason it does not seem like it's a widespread grief tactic. Hard to wrap my head around it - I think it comes down to too much competition for long shafts on its own makes fences unviable.

Oh dear god another rope sink? No thank you. Rope is hands down my least favorite mechanic of the entire game. Odd, such a crucial resource that is needed for sooo many things, that mankind has found ways to make out of nearly every fiber we work with, has one non renewable wild resource. To cultivate it - requires four tilled soil and 4 bowls of water. I will let you take whatever route you want to get this, none of them are good. Either you are tilling 3 bowls of soil for one tool use,  2 bowls for one tool use, or one bowl for two tool use. We can now refine oil to make kerosene to pump for water or to fly a crude airplane, but to make a single piece of rope it still takes:

1 Skewer | 1-2 Uses of a Steel Hoe or Stone Hoe (which takes a rope to make, super good icing on that shit cake)
4-12 Bowls of dirt
4 Bowls of water

Stone Hoe
1 Long Shaft @60 Min respawn time
1 Sharp Stone
1 Rope
2-5 Ropes per hoe before breaking -1 Rope to remake hoe (To save dirt and to till 1 bowl of dirt for every one rope you make you use one rope to make another hoe ~ at that rate consumption of sharp rocks is actually a thing let alone the shafts)

Steel Hoe
1 Long Shaft @60 Min respawn time
1 Iron + 1 lump coal
6-13 Ropes per hoe before break

Not considering all the time it takes to grow it - how long it might take to find a seed if people weren't being good before you, it's already daunting how costly a piece of rope is. I mean come on man, its freaking rope.

/endrant I agree we need a good solution and that is not it.

If the resource of time is low - using a resource that the other needs won't help. You need the boards to make the rooms, and now they would compete even more.

Doesn't that kill it right there? You are talking not having a pen up for 60+X minutes from the start of a camp, X being how long the eve has had before you were born. Another way to look at is, that if I was an eve and when I was dying of old age and there wasn't sheep already going, my last words would not be goodbye, they would be see you soon.

A lot of maple trees grow roughly the same rate as pine trees, they might grow for longer to a greater height, but from sapling to tree it's not that far off. Honestly the timers feel off, 1 hour to grow a tree and one hour for you to get one more branch from it? Either slash the growth timer or vice versa and cut down branch regrow timings. You'd need everyone to be on top of picking branches as they are walking by to heavily exploit a 30min branch timer, and extra shafts aren't going to drastically change the state of the game, we might possibly start making animal pens out of fences or something (would be a huge buff to charcoal, but is kindling scarcity ever a thing?)

So we need something that isn't in direction competition with other needs. Possibly could be another turnout from a butt log so every tree has them, but then competes, and what tool? Don't want another tool, nothing else makes sense, froe is boards, adze is mallet, saw is for disks. I suppose you could do Froe>New Beams>Saw>Boards but then you'd gate boards behind a saw which is another decent step. You need a chisel, a bow, goose, file and blade blank before you can make a saw, rather than just needing and adze and a froe. Reverse it maybe? Using a saw on boards would give fence kit instead of adze on two shafts. Already this is getting convoluted and require changing a few things, and makes me weary.

Best solution - Pine Trees. Make it redder in color and a little longer than the other logs to tell them apart. They would be gated behind an axe, and using a froe would yield two pine beams, which then could be turned into a fence kit. Beams could definitely be used for a lot of further tech down the road as well to give them more uses other than just fences. Keep the mechanics of building a fence, with using the shovel to dig a hole. Add in a Pitchfork that's two uses are to move poop and thresh wheat and we call it a day.

Pretty sure that kills like 4 birds with one stone or more. Potatoes do not compete with compost, graves do not compete with compost, removing stumps and rocks do not compete with compost, digging up adobe does not compete with compost, removing clay pits for building space does not compete with compost.... I really should have counted before starting to type all that came to mind.

My thoughts on a blessed system was basically reincarnation as a boy to be infertile (Adam) that you got a 30-45 life in the same town if you had been blessed enough. Would be nice in some way to have a way to reward a player rather than just curse someone. If it's on a long cooldown it's not like every life you will be using one.

Original Idea https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=5402