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#126 Re: News » Update: Apocalypse 2.0 » 2018-12-30 20:14:58

antking:]# wrote:

That's why we need a reset switch, you wish to prevent evil "monolith"  well then give people a reason to work and not kill!

While you are theoretically right and Jason argued exactly that way, the issue is, it hasn't been an issue yet... not even close.

#127 Re: Main Forum » Meta thoughts - Sheep and Carrots » 2018-12-30 20:04:11

There are several reasons for the sheep pen instead of the carrot fence:

* With a pen you easily determine how many unsheared sheep there are, having them roam freely it is a difficult call if you actually want to be sensible player not shearing the last sheep.
* You know where to find poop
* You know where to find fleece
* When killing sheep, you can put a horse-cart on a fence in or around the pen, putting all the mutton in it.

#128 Re: Main Forum » Localized Apocolypses » 2018-12-30 13:38:42

Crumpaloo wrote:

It would also encourage people to set up civilizations farther away from others which im sure is what Jason wants

Actually AFAIK no, civilizations ought to interact more.. otherwise each lineage could be it's own server map and be done with it, there currently is just no reason for them to interact... (for example there is no incentive to trade)

#129 Re: Main Forum » Slow times at night and what we can do. » 2018-12-30 12:12:51

Greep wrote:

My thought is maybe if you keep suiciding as eve you've got a decent chance to end in a city right?  Like if you're /dieing maybe it's during a time where there's a birth cooldown going on.  Although yeah all the towns will be wiped after a certain point.

I'm not sure without looking at the code, but my impression is, you become eve when there isn't a mother to assign you to. So it may be they are all on cool down at first in the city, but likely, if you become eve, there just isn't a larger lineage alive you aren't banned from anyway. PS: You can't /die as eve, you have to suicide.

#130 Re: Main Forum » Slow times at night and what we can do. » 2018-12-30 12:04:46

Greep wrote:

On a main server just /die until you end up in a city if you can.  Villages simply do not survive night time with the new changes to birthing.

I've tried that too at the slack hour, it's just, there sometimes isn't a city to /die to. I didn't feel like yet another eve camp that likely fails soon, so I /die'd a handful of times to eves, only to be spawned as eve myself from there on...

#131 Re: Main Forum » Just Why? » 2018-12-30 11:24:04

Azrael wrote:

This can get into a whole debate about who griefers are and who anti-griefers are, but to keep it related, let's just say griefers go against the people trying to be "productive members of society" if you want to make an apocalypse, the griefers will want it NOT to happen. Simple as that, it's a needed feature and makes the whole server reset once a month thing, which would've been annoying, have a gameplay aspect to it instead of all just Randomly by Jason.

Without discussing if there aren't better options to solve a problem that not yet existed, and albeit this might stray offtopic, but now this has started: the distinction between griefers and non-griefers is a matter of intention. If it gives someone the kicks to make someone else frustrated, then this is a griefer.

I remembered from the chess example another short story I once read, if you deliberately take your turns soooo slow to make the opponent angry and you enjoy that, you are a griefer. And sometimes game mechanic rules are enforced to make certain kinds harder, like a turn-clock in chess. So yes, game mechanic design is ultimately responsible to  confine griefing in a reasonable degree.

Coming back from this excursion. About apocalypse, I doubt this is a motivational enough for griefers. They'd have to invest a lot of time in it and get very little out of it, since they don't see people suffering. They can't laugh at somebodies face (or avatar) and not get an awkward sense of superiority. Unless maybe people complain like hell on the forums etc. but with current mechanics I don't see this coming either.

Fact is, the nocturnal infertility issue is a much bigger reset mechanism already in place and yes albeit sometime people managed to restart towns, I didn't see one live beyond a week anyway. Really we didn't have yet the issue that we all were bored in cars driving in circles.

#132 Re: Main Forum » Visualization of lineage duration over time » 2018-12-30 07:59:43

CrazyEddie wrote:
thundersen wrote:

Well over 90% of all lineages die in less than one hour.

This is not surprising, exactly, but the scale of it is pretty staggering. 90% ?? Wow.

Being Eve is hard, sure, but man people sure are bad at it.

Might clean up by obvious suicides tough. Like remove all lineages that are shorter than 5 minutes.

PS: It may not be the Eves fault, but Gen 2, for example one eve run of mine, found a nice spot, took care of my babies, yet they all died due to inexperience or simply suicided right away on purpose without /die hmm, when I was 40 and all kids dead, I suicided.

#133 Re: Main Forum » Visualization of lineage duration over time » 2018-12-30 07:57:59

thundersen wrote:

- The award for the longest lineage in this time period goes to EVE NEZAT who was born on server 2 at 13:53:57 UTC on November 17. She was the ancestor for a whooping 2135 descendants.

The number of descendants is the area, the longest would be the number of generations. You could have 2000 descendants in a few generations if you get a baby every 2 minutes...

#134 Re: Main Forum » Nosaj knife activition and how to do it without someone dying » 2018-12-30 06:34:12

Jk Howling wrote:

or just abuse the snowball glitch and hit them with a snowball before stabbing. The knife wound doesn't overwrite the snowball effect so you get your bloody knife and they walk away after the 10 second coldness cooldown with no other issue.

Yeah, it's about time conditions on players become a vector instead of a field with all kind of weird overriding rules..

#135 Re: Main Forum » Does picking up a block and putting it back reset the timer? » 2018-12-30 06:32:21

Justduh wrote:

Same goes for bell towers.

bell towers are indestructible.

#136 Re: Main Forum » Is endstone a real belief? » 2018-12-30 06:30:01

hmrka wrote:

Also dont worry It will take weeks maybe more If people even manage to do it (which I doubt)

It's certainly possible with enough dedication. You need a group of players "investing" about 36h around the clock. Make a lineage were you kill off all babies not of your group, always /die until you are in your group. Make all the blocks, bake a lot of pies then close off an area with unbreakable walls, like tower bases. Then start building it, while feeding of the pie pile. Nobody can stop you, even if they get there and want to.

However it's certainly a lot of investment of not really fun game play for little result.

PS: Yeah, we might need some sort of resetting, I just wonder if this is the right way. Might also turn this into something positive... like a group of players taking their lineage through portal to a new world or just having the eve-spiral wander in a "galactic clock" round a circle, that will naturally remove all lineages over time.

This way feels a little too much "Rust" like, where the game mechanics are set up for "dance my puppets, dance".

#137 Main Forum » Idea: partial apocalypse(s) » 2018-12-29 06:39:42

lionon
Replies: 0

Thinking about the what the apocalypse could mean I remembered an old anime show, "Captain Future". In one episode one of the tribes on a moon defended themselves against human invaders by spreading "deadly ash", which made all metals on the planet fall apart and thus the high-tech-way of the humans (as aliens here) impossible. (Until the Captain as fantastic as he is develops a cure for it, but anyway).

So for the apocalypse, instead of resetting everything how about a partial apocalypse?

For example Metalcalypse:

all metals reset, but stone, clay etc. is unaffected. And instead of a white flash could do an in-game performance. For say 30 minutes, all iron tools lose a use every 3 minutes by themselves, at the same time all iron and steel ingots disappear one by one. The bell tower loses it's bell. the oil rigs turn to newcomen towers, etc. Then after 30 minutes the natural metal resources start to refill (thinking of like "nanintes" that bring them all back). Collapsed mine shafts turn into iron veins. Gold veins reappear and open iron reappears in the badlands.

The towns have a) make it through that time without having sensible use of metal and b) rebuild metal things afterwards.


Stonecalypse:

Similar than the metalcalype but only stones are affected. Ancient walls first turn into normal stone walls, then crumble, stone roads disappear, the bell tower turns into a bell and a stanchionkit. Ah yes round and sharpened stones disappear... until after a while they all start returning back on their original spawn points.

Organicalypse: Same thing with wood and other natural products like baskets, etc.

Animalcalypse: All animals turn into mad versions that will attack any players. Then after a while die. Then after a little more respawn in their natural state.

#138 Re: Main Forum » It's that time of the year, apocalypse is back! » 2018-12-28 14:58:54

Well the return of apocalypse seems like the answer for a problem that just wasn't there (yet).

However complaining about it and it's mechanics now might be just as well... so I guess lets see how it turns out.

#139 Re: Main Forum » Anti-Greifing (For Killers) » 2018-12-28 07:22:00

Crumpaloo wrote:

so if you dont know what you are doing just give them to someone who does.

Are basically don't hoard them in the first place regardless how talented you think you are, like everyone here tried to tell you in a nicer or in a more direct manner.

#140 Re: Main Forum » Reviving Dead Towns » 2018-12-28 06:58:25

It would be nice to have some in game mechanic to detect lost cities and run/ride/drive there.

radar? Dunno...

#141 Re: Main Forum » Anti-Greifing (For Killers) » 2018-12-28 06:52:02

Well that griefer has "learned" to be more manipulative the next time hmm

#142 Re: Main Forum » It's that time of the year, apocalypse is back! » 2018-12-28 06:48:52

Well basically an apocalypse can be forced by 3 players coordinating via discord and taking turns (/die until you are in the apocalypse-lineage and kill all other babies). Put enough food and lock the area with unbreakable blocks like bell tower bases. All the public warnings are void.

PS: It's just a mood point, since in 24 hours most lineage will be wiped by nocturnal infertility anyway.

#143 Re: Main Forum » One City Server » 2018-12-28 06:42:49

Just updated the practice server, no issues I found. My patch just didn't apply cleanly as Jason changed some code in the same lines this time.

Yes, as far as I see the database for OHOL-server is not "hot", I guess the server will only write it when it unloads a chunk, thus when you kill it ungracefully, you lose the chunks that were only in memory at that time.

PS: Maybe choose a warmer spot, that city was way cold...
I also saw Babies teleporting, I guess this may get an issue for the client when the mother is on another map chunk. Did you override just the eve spawn location or the spawn location for every new connection?

#144 Re: Main Forum » One City Server » 2018-12-28 05:59:22

Greep wrote:

Okay, merges worked. Most of the town constructions are gone, so I'm going to see if I can fix that before getting the server online again.  It might just be gone permanently because I had to stop the server using kill since I wasn't sure how to stop it gracefully as a background process.  Not sure yet.

I recommend using "screen" (or tmux) to run the server, there you can always get the console of a running process. You start in foreground within screen/tmux and this one handles the process backgrounding.

I didn't yet look on the code how Jason made the Ctrl+z thingy, I suppose he catches the SIGTSTP a. k. a stop signal? In that case you could also send SIGTSTP via kill.

#145 Re: News » Update: Apocalypse 2.0 » 2018-12-28 05:52:41

Is there an .ini file setting to disable it on custom servers?
It's okay if it can be all build, it just shouldn't cause the apocalypse...

Okay easy enough to find, settings/apocalypsePossible.ini

#146 Re: Main Forum » One City Server » 2018-12-27 22:30:29

Nice idea. Please add a transistion for "newcomen base + pickaxe = pickaxe" so we can destroy that stupid no-pen someone did.

Might also make sense a time lapse (-1) transition for collapsed mine + 48h = mine shaft?

#147 Re: Main Forum » Basic Forge » 2018-12-27 12:22:08

Just move the forge outside the city.

The issue is always the same, in the eve camp they build the kiln near the farm, because everything is small. Then they use it for the startup tools. Then the city grows the eve kiln/forge becomes the smithy right in the middle of the town. Just rebuild another smithy a little outside of the city and you can smith in peace...

I'm just a little torn on the question if the old smithy should be destroyed or not.

#148 Re: Main Forum » Anti-Greifing (For Killers) » 2018-12-26 19:29:26

Three wrote:

The knives should be spread out, if one griefer gets one knife and stabs the knife hog what are you going to do? He has all the weapons. If they are spread out you have a much higher chance to kill the griefer

I agree. Tell you a story. The town I was in was in horrible shape, the compost cycle didn't work, there lots of bread doughs in the kitchen - since the plates we're all filled and waiting for mutton and the pen full of shorn sheep. Hunger was also a problem. So I go and made a knife. Yes, I admit my error was to make that knife without having a backpack, but that town desperately needed sheep to be cut and bread to made.... So I cut the sheep, I make the bread, and then some stupid women came and stole my knife "for protection"... (yes I had to put it down for eating, since no backpack).. Seriously... then I saw that the had already 2 knifes in her backpack! She was hording them "for security"... while the town suffered of no knifes. Now she had three. Well as I couldn't do much about it, I kept going to her and pestering to do the knife jobs at least, if she already insists of thinking she is the one and only trustworthy player here (btw, seriously???). Well and then like it was asking for trouble a twin pair of real griefers shot her... and there is was nothing I could do about it as the other was looting her backpack. See? She was real pest, and albeit well intended if the intention would be different it would be griefing... taking all knifes, not doing the knife jobs, and in the end "giving" it all to "another" griefer...

#149 Re: Main Forum » Question about Eve spawn location "exploit" » 2018-12-26 17:09:47

CrazyEddie wrote:

"Only keeping females" only helps if you can persuade the males to /die. Otherwise you're just giving up one of your limited number of birth slots, where each birth produces a positively-contributing productive tribe member. If you coordinate a group of players on Discord you can all agree to /die and thereby have a keep-the-city-alive private party, but the bulk of players on the public servers aren't going to adopt the "if you are born male you should /die because it's the optimal strategy" mentality.

Since the rare resource is actually players, /die is a stupid idea, better suicide as a male and be reborn as a female, the birth cooldown for the mother is a minimal setback compared of losing a player willing to contribute to the line.

Discord organized people /die on low pop servers (<10 players) (or <= dunno) when born as male since the lineage ban only kicks in after this threshold.

#150 Re: Main Forum » Anti-Greifing (For Killers) » 2018-12-26 10:35:09

Crumpaloo wrote:

All of these criticism are either half baked or or just plain insults, of course you wanna have the backpack on at all times, ive never implied to throw it all in a pile, quite the opposite actually. Some people just dont got the will to go through with killing a greifer and that where i cant see your point. If its gonna come down to letting someone im very sure is a griefer stay alive and potentially kill the entire village, and saving the village, im gonna pick the latter, moderating your trust and knowing what to do in these situations is alot more important then just standing idly by and hoping you dont get a greifer born.

If at least you would have read the criticism so far to get it is called a griefer.

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