One Hour One Life Forums

I just told you the threshold in which berry rabbits become better than the alternative Alias gave. That's with the same costs so this can be dismissed. This is entirely about pip efficiency, you have to waste 4 pips of every bite of rabbit pies and eat 6 berries with no waste for it to be worse than berry rabbit without waste.

Do you not like when people give you information you wanted?

How i this irrelevant, I literally gave you a tool to calculate this

Crumpaloo wrote:

The main thing that bugs me is that i dont know where the thresh-hold for pip efficeincy goes off, i mean of course smaller items are more pip efficeint then larger ones, but how many smaller foods would you need to add until the amount of average waste the larger food wastes equals out to the average pip value of the a bunch of the smaller foods? difficult stuff...

This formula allows you to change the values of bites, food amount and waste (based on number of pips and your food levels), all vaues that you can change and plot on a graphic or just compare. You could potentially do it to every food in the game for every value of waste you desired. But fuck me for also considering costs in my formula, I guess, didn't have to overcomplicate.

Crumpaloo wrote:

DestinyCall wrote:

I'm no longer new and I can't speak for every new player, but back when I first started, I managed to survive to 60 as a berry tender and successfully raised a handful of babies during my first play session.   Admittedly, that was after five or six early deaths, but only the first one was avoidable.  The rest happened because I was born to neglectful (or fatally wounded) mothers.

However, I owe that long life in large part to my uncle, who taught me about berry plants and showed me a safe way to help our village.   I doubt I would have lived that long without his help, because I was not very good at watching my temp as a noob.   I will still teach berry tending as a first lesson, if someone is brand new.  Keeps them in the village and close to a reliable food source, so the chance of accidental death by starvation or cold is reduced (unless the berry patch is built over tundra).

In that teaching i probably could of planted 20 berry bushes. Teaching a new player something you could of already done in the time it takes to teach them is just being lazy and looking for someone else to do it.

i think you are SEVERELY overestimating time it takes to teach a new player anything. i taught someone to berry farm earlier in less than five minutes. including getting soil from out of town. if you can honestly say you can plant twenty berry bushes in less than five minutes, while fetching soil and not relying on compost someone else made, then surely your time shouldnt be wasted on this game.

it really doesnt take long to stop and tell someone 'hey, when bushes turn brown, scoop up the soil, put it on the plant, do the same with water, and youre good to go'. most of the time, you can do this while nursing the kid, then get back to your task- be it cooking, composting, whatever- once the kid gets hair. it's not hard, and it doesnt take that long, like you're trying to insinuate.

Booklat1 wrote:

Alias wrote:

Make all the popcorn you want. Milk will always give more food, no matter how "pip efficient" popcorn is. Even if you fed theoretical family of only newborns, milk will always give them more food than popcorn from the same amount of corn. And this is impossible, worst case. You can be efficient at minimizing waste, I will be efficient at maximizing actual calories intake with all waste factored in.

Also, for one soil and one bowl of water you can make 48 food worth of popcorn. For 1 water you can make 160 worth of mutton pie. You have to waste more than a third of the pies for popcorn to be on their level. That's why you consider the other factors, crumpaloo, you don't just dismiss them.

Yes. But even if we stay at equal cost he provided better example than I could come up with: suddenly rabbit berry pie ended up in top tier of his list. It gives 4x18 pips. But at the exact same cost (actually a bit less effort) you can get rabbit pie (4x14) plus 6 berries (6x5). It's better on bite count, total pip value and even on his precious pip efficiency. After all this talk he put THIS in top tier.

Yes alias, it is ridiculous to waste corn with popcorn when you have milk because it's a waste to make a food that produces less food.
Pip efficiency is not a very good metric for waste and that is the point.

Saying mutton pies are "not that bad" and milk is wasteful is wrong. Well, sure, you may lose some of the pips drinking milk, but how much milk did you make in the first place?

I get it, this post is about pips not used. It gives however, wrong ideas about the importance of this.

Léonard wrote:

Crumpaloo wrote:

That would require noobs to not die before they could have babies

Alright show me the proof that noobs die before they can have babies every single time.
I'm waiting.

I'm no longer new and I can't speak for every new player, but back when I first started, I managed to survive to 60 as a berry tender and successfully raised a handful of babies during my first play session.   Admittedly, that was after five or six early deaths, but only the first one was avoidable.  The rest happened because I was born to neglectful (or fatally wounded) mothers.

However, I owe that long life in large part to my uncle, who taught me about berry plants and showed me a safe way to help our village.   I doubt I would have lived that long without his help, because I was not very good at watching my temp as a noob.   I will still teach berry tending as a first lesson, if someone is brand new.  Keeps them in the village and close to a reliable food source, so the chance of accidental death by starvation or cold is reduced (unless the berry patch is built over tundra).

read my post, please. you'll waste food making berry rabbit pies long before you eat them if you don't. Even with waste you get rabbit pies + bowl of berries being about as efficient as rabbit berry pies with no waste. There is math to prove that. You need to eat all rabbit pies at 10 pips for this combo to be equally as bad as a non-wasted berry rabbit pie.

Cost >>>>>> waste

Gederian wrote:

I think you are both right and just mad at each other.

Pies are needed when traveling and are a byproduct so you must make them. You got off on the wrong foot here, arguing two different points.

The low pip vs high pip argument is probably mute anyways. You can't really control the major variable (what people eat) so just preach about YUM! Berry in bowl is not the same as berry in hand!

Let's just all be friends and do octo eves!

Agreed. That's why when producing it's good to focus on maximum results at minimum cost. You can provide foods optimized for least waste or optimized for full bellies at similar cost. Latter is better, because that's  the thing  that counts in  the game. If youcan make your village overflow with food from milk, mutton pie and turkey then you are all good and your family is set to die of nocturnal infertility and not of starvation

I think you are both right and just mad at each other.

Pies are needed when traveling and are a byproduct so you must make them. You got off on the wrong foot here, arguing two different points.

The low pip vs high pip argument is probably mute anyways. You can't really control the major variable (what people eat) so just preach about YUM! Berry in bowl is not the same as berry in hand!

Let's just all be friends and do octo eves!

Alright Crumpaloo after looking at some of your other threads, I imagine that you consider yourself a fine swiss watchmaker.  Somebody who cares deeply about every pip of food and that it is allocated in a perfect bite every time.  Somebody whom wants to see an entire town of sims dance in a perfect weave of motion and purpose.  Except that ain't life.

In all actuality, we probably aren't that far off in our desire to see town running at peak efficiency, but our methods of getting there are vastly different.  I'm going to take a moment to troll you here, and I'm saying it up front so everyone knows that I'm intending to only lightheartedly tease you.  You know who else would count out every pip of food for their populous?  Communists!  So start your bread line comrade!  (Or kraut, as you have already done that!)  You know who else preached euthanasia of the weak?  Nazis!  Clearly them noob babies had it coming!  With enough propaganda, one day you'll have your glorious fatherland.  Even if it is only for an hour!

The_Anabaptist

DestinyCall wrote:

I'm not worried about the math error you made in your initial post.  I'm worried that you are still arguing that mutton pie is not a good food choice overall.  You are still claiming that it might get wasted by inconsiderate or lazy villagers.  The point of my post was that even in an absolute worst case scenario, mutton pies are superior to the available alternative.   

There is a problem at the core of your food theory and the math related to mutton pies helps to illustrate it in a very clear way.   I think you really need to take a step back and re-think your approach to pip efficiency if you want to identify which foods are really best for the village.

This. He will not abandon his "pip efficiency" theory. He created his own food benchmark where he claims that pip efficiency if key factor, but each tier in this benchmark has foods with both high and low "pip efficiency", showing that its non-factor.

But the best part is him putting rabbit berry pie in top tier. This is 4x18 and is huuuge waste on all fronts. With the same ingredients and less effort you can create rabbit pie which is 4x14 and still have bowl of goose berries so 6x5. This option is faster, gives more total pips, is more "pip efficient" and gives more bites.
And yet he put rabbit berry pie at the top Bravo!

Sorry, Crumpaloo, but it seems there's something lacking in your knowledge and approach to the game. You messed up how skim milk is made, same for pies in this thread, ommited total plant output when comparing beans and corn, admitted you can eat pie twice cause you don't care and now glorify pie that is sin to make like potatoes. More and more people tell you that, but you create more and more topics and posts in response. You might have many hours in the game, but your posts question how they were spent.

Crumpaloo wrote:

Gotta disagree with the whole more bites the better theroy, other guy tried to argue that point and i just told him this. If you had one food with 1 pip, you could add as many uses to that food as you wanted, as long as the pip value of the food remains the same, the bites wont have any affect, this shows that bites/uses of a food are solely dependent of the pip value of the food itself, think of it like a multiplier, you can multiply any number by zero, but so long as its zero, the number doesn't  matter. Another way to thiink of it is like the flat bonus jason added to the game, it goes on top of the base values after the fact.

Not gonna argue that making bread and mutton instead of the pies themselves is not just losing pips, although i wont agree that mutton pies are a good food choice overall, the number of pips your average player eats at doesnt line up nicely with mutton pies which makes it very easy to waste alot of it if you dont wanna be bothered looking for another food. Considering everyone has access to your food supply its best to assume worst case scenario.

Dear god.   Talking to you is like throwing rubber balls at a brick wall.   

The number of total bites is critical.  Look at the numbers again.   When you make those ingredients into food, you can either end up with 12 bites of food with a total pip value of 112 (bread and cooked mutton) or 16 bites of food with a total pip value of 240 (mutton pies).  If someone eats food in the most wasteful way possible (by eating a bite with only one spent hunger pip), each wasteful bite would only provide 1 pip, regardless of the max value of the food. 

In that case, you could get 16 pips out of the mutton pies and 12 pips from the mutton and bread.  Pies still come out ahead.   Of course, you could argue that you "lost" more by wasting the mutton pies (224 pips lost vs 100 lost), but that is completely meaningless when you consider that by making roast mutton and bread, you would already be sacrificing 128 pips due to opportunity cost.   The mutton and bread is more wasteful AND gives fewer total pips.  Inefficiency related to over-consumption has no impact on this situation.   It does not matter. 

Worst case scenario ... you should still make mutton pies instead of cooking the raw ingredients seperately.  Always.  Even if you are feeding crazy, over-eating babies and stubborn old people who hate berries.    Mutton pies are just that good.