a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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Well played good sir! I appreciate your reasoned and well thought out response.
But honestly I was sorta just messing with you, the " You can kill a city (and I have) over, and over, and over" statement kinda irked me a lil.The first quote was the second one I looked at after a random search of collateral damage and it made me chuckle a little. Also fitted
Then I had to defend the statement when you inevitably questioned it..
Annoying when someone wastes your time isn't it?I have said elsewhere though I can understand the ideology behind wiping and area so new gameplay can progress.
It's just a lot of people want a city life to learn and progress themselves which they can't do in Eve camps/early settlements. They want to feel valued and progress their knowledge without the constant pressure of feeling like they're in the way, or just eating all the farm then dying because they don't know what else to do in game yet.Let city folk do their thing, you do yours, it's not like the world isn't big enough...
Yes, it is indeed annoying when someone wastes your time. That is why I try to take conversations seriously because I don't want to waste theirs ![]()
Like I said though, I enjoy me a good city run as much as the next guy. I don't want to be stuck making a forge and a farm every 30 minutes. I understand you being irked, but it didn't have anything to do with trying to force everyone to only do eve runs. I know that probably doesn't make it any better, but just wanted to make sure that's known. I'm not out to kill the city life and what people like about it. And I don't want to take up any more of your time, so I wont expect a response.
Thank you for taking the time to have a serious conversation, it is appreciated.
LOL. I read this and my jaw dropped. A salted griefer complaining about the game. Make a sister civ instead of griefing, because I love cities. The bigger, the better. You can't have real power without a large number of people, and you can't have a large number without a city. Destroying a city doesn't solve your problem nearly as well as... leaving. Just get the fuck out and let me rule with an iron fist. I want to accumulate the obedience of the masses, and you're fucking that up if you get angry about large civs. The game is no fun to me when it's just setting up farms and hunting rabbits. I like the social aspect of it, and solving complex problems that come with high gen civs.
Also, griefers shouldn't be complaining. Like, yeah, griefers are actually very important to how I enjoy the game - I always need to catch you motherfuckers and kill you - and that shit is FUN. You're all so salty. But jus taccept that you don't actually solve any problems, you only create them.
Oh, wonderful. Another person to add to the list of those that have misunderstood. Well get in line good sir. So, for the umpteenth time, I have no problem with large cities. Contrary to your belief, I'm a big fan of large cities. That's not what I have a problem with. I guess you can be forgiven for not reading any of the other posts, but that just means I have to repeat myself a lot. So, for the sake of not repeating myself, and because you seem like the kind of person that likes to remain blissfully unaware, I'll just go ahead and let you carry on. If you actually intend to add to the discussion, rather than make a giant ass of yourself, I'll be more than happy to engage you in conversation.
"British Dictionary definitions for terrorism
terrorismnoun
systematic use of violence and intimidation to achieve some goal
the act of terrorizing
the state of being terrorized"Not necessarily 'political' but you def are trying to achieve a goal, purely of your own beliefs, over a far greater number of others goal of living, learning and building.
What makes your single belief far outweigh multiple others to a point that you have to annihilate any trace of them.
Some days I don't really find myself in the mood for city life, so I'll do something else. I don't usually find my self in a state of bloodlust and murder bound. Interesting why you feel the need to or can try and justify it.
Then I guess by that definition, I could see how something like that would be considered terrorism. I understood it as terrorism only when you're trying to convince others to submit to your ideology. I also don't think "killing innocent civilians" equates to anything in this game. More like someone's sand castle getting knocked over, (often times ones they took from someone else). Still, I see your point and reasoning for bringing up that quote. Honestly, I can't tell if my last paragraph was just poorly constructed, or if it's a bunch of white knights jumping to conclusions. I didn't mean to imply that I "annihilate any trace of a civilizations just because of my own personal beliefs", but looking back, maybe I have at one point or another. Was I just rationalizing with the belief of self defense or retribution. I thank you for your insight and giving me things to reflect on.
I did read your post, but I dont really understand your problem.
You dont want to see the same citys over and over again? - change server, atm we are split up on 1/2 most of the time, somtimes even 3. That should do for a day.
Does is really make a difference if a city is lost forever? No! It will be rebuild roughly the same again. So only the layout changes a bit.About that suciding for 30 mins. If you dont like it, just dont do it. Accept your life, and if its in that same town again just move out and start a new settlement.
Yeah, I was meaning to comment on your starting a new settlement idea. I like it. I'll consider that the next time I want to have an eve run but am stuck in town hell. I mean, it does come with it's own problems like kids finding their way back and competing for the resource of lineage babies; but it is a thought to consider.
And I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. I don't mind seeing the same cities over and over again. I don't want to see the same hi jacked city from some lazy eve over and over again. I like to stay on one server at a time because I like to be born into cities I've worked on several generations later. Like I said, you've misunderstood me (which could be my fault). I never meant to say that I'm a city hater and that I only want eve runs, I'm sorry if I came across that way. I was trying to say that it sucks that there seems to be almost no new blood circulating, which bums me out. I feel like if something dies, something else should be born. I don't think you should just keep reanimating it's zombified corpse. But again, that's just how I enjoy the game, I don't expect anyone else to adhere to it. I wasn't trying to lay down some decree, I was just seeing if anyone shared similar thoughts.
And it does make a difference if a city is lost forever. It makes a huge difference. Things are much more important when there's a possibility of losing them.
Well sure, there are many options. You could also choose to just kill the town and I don't think anyone but those that always "accept their life" no matter what could criticize you. You could also just play something else for a bit, which is never a bad option.
"Asymmetrical warfare is a euphemism for terrorism, just like collateral damage is a euphemism for killing innocent civilians."
Alan Dershowitz
I don't see how terrorism plays any part in the discussion. Nothing has been done in the pursuit of political gains, so that seems an odd choice of quotes. And there is collateral damage in a lot of things, although it definitely doesn't always extend to the reaches of "killing innocent civilians". So while I appreciate the insight, I don't think it's relevant.
FeignedSanity wrote:sc0rp wrote:Butthurt griefer or what?
I'm not sure what you mean by this.
I was referring to this:
That is exactly what I was referring to, you still haven't specified what exactly you meant with your comment. I'm just going to assume you meant to say that I was a "butthurt griefer" and taking actions solely based on this belief.
A lot of people miss those times. Solution to you problem it trivial: baby suicide 3-4 times. With esc+% takes 30 seconds. Or switch to different server, where there are no towns.
Why you want to prevent people that like to play in towns from doing so?
And I swear, no one is reading the whole OP. I said that I have baby suicide multiple times, and don't want to have to keep repeatedly doing so. And the solution, is by no means trivial. It is a very tedious, and sometimes time consuming process. I don't start up the game just to close and open it another 15 times. And there are not "servers with no towns", just ghost servers.
But like I said to West, I have no problem with towns. I think it's nice to not have to start up a kiln and a farm every run. I was just saying that it bugs me that all of the "town deaths" feel like a massive farce. I want a town to feel special, and important. Something that has been working on for 15 generations, not something that some eve stumbled onto and put on like someone's old underwear. And by the same hand, if a town I worked on dies, I want it to feel poignant. But that's the reason why I don't stick around, you seem to think that that's the reason I kill cities. Which is what you assumed I said. Sure, I have (very rarely) killed cities for various reasons, but never because I wanted to punish them for playing how they like. Besides, from the sound of things, it seems like that would be your philosophy. Why would you want to discourage me from murdering towns if, hypothetically speaking, that was the way I liked to play. I could easily turn it around and claim that eve (start up) baby suicide is ruining the experience of others, and by your definition, be considered griefing. But I feel like all of this is neither here nor there.
But I never intend to get on the topic of town killing or griefing. Nor did I want to give you fodder for your self-righteous crusade to crucify murderers. Looking back at my original post, I can see now how you would get that perception. It was merely to see if the fact that no one seems to be starting anything fresh is bothering anyone. It appears it is not.
Honestly, who even uses these? They're so impractical, you may as well just carry things one by one; it'll take just about as long. They seem more of a griefing tool than anything else. Yes, I know you can, and maybe should, turn it into a chest. Then, while you're at it, forge a lock and key just to be safe. But that's not the point. These feel like they're in the game just to be there. I would like it to be if someone is going to turn my box into a cart, they at least have to put a wheel on it and make it useful.
I suggest that we do away with sledges and just make it a transition phase from box to cart, (where you can remove the straight shaft). Thoughts?
Butthurt griefer or what?
I'm not sure what you mean by this. Juvenile terminology aside, I'm not sure what exactly you're trying to say here. If you're trying to call me a griefer, I would say that I don't consider myself one. I consider a griefer to be someone that tries to ruin other peoples experience just for the enjoyment of ruining other's experience, which I do not. However, the term "collateral damage" springs to mind. If you're trying to say I'm upset, I wouldn't say so. I would say it's a normal thing to experience emotions such as frustration or irritation, but I wouldn't go so far as to say I'm upset by anything. It is just a game after all. I would be mindful that you're not projecting.
I think that trying to start a separate fire for coals, just to have some jackass put firewood on it, is equally frustrating. It's like, "My guy, there's a large fire right over there. Why the fuck did you think we needed another?"
Just suicide until you are the eve yourself? Then you can start from scratch.
Or if you are a girl, why dont you go play mini eve and start a new villige somewhere around the town? Thats fun too!
Did you read the original post? I mentioned baby suicide and how I don't want to spend 30 minutes of suicide, but have because that's how the game functions. And while I do think that baby suicide is a stupid, tedious mechanic that shouldn't even be in the game. My biggest problem is that nothing ever seems to die or end. There's no ending to any of these cities, death is pointless. A city dying out doesn't mean a damn thing, so there's no stakes. It's so fucking pointless, some jackass is going to spawn into it 20 minutes later. The fact that it seems easy to just to respawn into, or trip over a dead city.
I guess it's a combination of things that really bug me. I was really just trying to see if anyone else has noticed what I've noticed, and if so, what they thought about it.
So it appears I have misspoken in my first attempt at this post. The general understanding I got is that it is believed that I am a greifer and city hater. I have (albeit rarely) killed cities in the past and that was the main point of conversation. So, I would like to just say I am not against cities, but I personally don't enjoy being in a city that some lazy eve spawned into and proceeded to use like old gym shorts. I don't like this, so I don't stick around.
I do not kill cities on this premise and, for the most part, I live and let live. I have felt like this has become much more prevalent and decided to seek outside opinions on the forum. It is my understanding that everyone is unanimously okay with, and even endorse, this practice; so I have learned I am in the vast minority. Thank you for any additional comments and discussion.
Crow wrote:So on the PvE server how would we stop someone from stealing all the food, hiding all the tools, breaking down the forge, kidnapping babies etc? Ask them to stop?
Killing was put in for a reason.
Killing wasn't put in for the reason of resource management and you can't deal with player vs environment griefing without a live admin staff.
Also if the game's killing mechanic was actually viable. It would make sense that a killer could drop his knife and feed himself, which isnt possible.
Killing doesnt have any real viable reason in OHOL, since most tools that can be used to kill put the user at a disadvantage. So unless you're willing to explain, how killing is viable. Im surprised there isn't a pve server.
Jason has basically said that is the exact reason murder is in the game. Repeatedly. And it's a good reason, at that. And the reason you're put at a disadvantage, it because it's not supposed to be for PvP. You're not supposed to be able to run around racking up your killstreak. It's supposed to be for when that one guy is running around being an asshole, and you kill him. Other people will be willing to take care of you and feed you because you've done them a service. That's the idea, anyway.
So if you could kindly tell me how you would deal with someone running around screaming slurs, smashing your forge, and letting the sheep loose. I seriously doubt they'd sit down and have a rational discussion where you convince them to change their behavior.
You are rude, Theo Dragon.
Who turns a man's file into scrap? I worked hard on that DX
Didn't get to say last words, so I'm saying them here. You didn't say GG or anything, I expected better. You sir, have no class. You could've at least said nice shot ![]()
Anyway, GGWP sir.
Nah just kidding, your writing style makes u seem older.
Huh, I don't really get that. From what I've seen, the age makes a lot of sense. Was kind of surprised at the guesses in the 30's or late 20's.
I enjoyed reading this.
Thanks for saying so, I'm glad you enjoyed it. Was contemplating doing it more often if enough people enjoyed it, so that's probably going to be a no. But man, all the great stories this game can provide. I'm glad I was able to get back into this game.
I was born into a sprawling village. This incarnation set out to be like any other, but little did I know, it would not be an average one. My mother took me to the medic shack and asked if I wanted to be a doctor. After getting me outfitted in some kindly elder's apron, Mother continued to carry me as she sought out her own mother. I was with her when she finally hunted my grandmother down and confronted her. Mother was scolding her for daring to tell others how to raise their children, while hers went unloved. My grandmother was remorseful and sought to make amends. It was then she informed my grandmother that throughout it all, my mother still named me after her. I was to carry on her name, and do the name proud.
After I had grown and was able to fend for myself, I set out to see how I could help my village. I noticed that several bowls were taken up by the devil's meat, carnitas; a vile food that requires many steps before it can serve any purpose, to which very few know. I spent years searching for and preparing the limestone needed to make use of the meat. During my task, a rather odd but kindly old man joined in. He didn't seem know what he was doing, but could roll the tortillas well enough. He asked me how I made the dough, so I tried to summarize it as best I could. He was amazed to find that the dough was made from limestone, to which we both had a few good laughs. After we made the last beef tacos, I stated how glad I was to finally make use of that stupid meat. I mentioned that they were probably made by someone with ill intentions, to which he informed me that he was the one who made them. He didn't know how complex the process was to actually use the meat and thanked me for helping him to get rid of them. He spent the rest of his days handing out tacos to the entire village, shouting the praises of the glorious tacos. I left the wonderfully crazy old man to his tacos and set out to find my mother.
While I was searching for her, I happened to stumble across my long lost older brother. I had not known any of my siblings and was happy to see one was doing well. I asked him about our mother, and to my dismay, he informed me that she had already passed. I asked him if he could show me where she died, and he took me to her grave. He said her last wish was to be buried where she died. I don't know the importance of the spot she picked, but he did as he was asked and filled her dying wish. I told him the least I could do, was mark the grave. For a time we reminisced about our mother. He had known her far better than I, and told me stories about her; like the time she stabbed someone just for making a file. What a wild woman she must have been.
I had grown close to this older brother I had never known. Which is why it pained me when his time drew near. Even in his twilight years, he was still just carrying on. I doubt he even had any plans for his passing, so I asked him if he would like to be buried next to mom. He told me he would like that; and so we stood by mother's grave, just talking until eventually he grew silent. I stood there with my family, but I was now alone. I figured I would do him the same honor of a proper burial, and maybe some kind person could do the same for me. So for my last few years, I gave him a proper burial and set up a nice little family grave.
Unfortunately, I was never to join my family. Some bratty kid was going about attempting to remove their graves. Obviously this couldn't be done, but that didn't stop her from trying, or very vocally cursing the ones that had put them there. I told her that it was my family grave and to please be respectful. Before I could even go so far as to ask anyone if they could bury me with my family, she threw a fit about how our graves were inconveniently "in the middle of her kitchen" and set about defiling our names. I didn't have long to live and was fairly certain that none of the onlookers would be able or willing to give me the burial I wanted. So in my final moments I struck her down, for her cruel disrespect of me and my loved ones. My final words were ones declaring vengeance for my family's name. I knew that I could never join them, but that at least I could rest easy knowing they could not be disturbed. This is the tale of Tallen.
Let me know if you enjoyed the story or if you found their graves ![]()
They're on server one, in the kitchen ![]()
But if we post on Reddit we will get cancer..
Oh YAHG, that's just an old wives tale. You also wont go blind from sitting too close to the TV ![]()
I went south at first, then went up north. Didn't find anyone, but that's probably because I did it minutes after the update went live. I honestly thought there'd be more after the tree, even replied to the news post cause I thought I was missing something. So I'm guessing all those other tutorial set ups are actually being used by people? That's interesting, hmmm...
I wasn't aware you'd be going through the whole backlog of ideas. Even with the upvotes, I feel they might get buried beyond retrieval. And it probably would be too daunting of a task if left for too long, but I get it. I understand if it's just to use when you are unsure of what to work on next, but I got the impression that it was going to be a more integral part of the development process.
I guess I will go ahead and post, and hope for the best. I will also hope that the whole "will do, won't do, maybe someday" thing will be used and updated more often, (especially the stickied post). Just kind of wondering why the thread wasn't more popular, seeing if it might have something to do with a sense of irrelevance (not sure if that's the right word, but I'm tired lol).
Awesome. While the additional challenge was entertaining, I feel like I might have missed something. I don't mean to spoil, so I'll just say the end was a little odd. Was that it? I guess what I'm asking is, what end area are you talking about? You're just meaning past the torch, yeah?
So does Jason even look at this anymore? It seems pretty dead. I was thinking about using it but I feel like I'd be wasting my time because it seems neglected. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Jason has only commented on one post in the past two months. I wonder if this is because he doesn't really value it anymore. In which case, why is this post still stickied?
Also, I'm sure that the stickied post by the old greg guy hasn't been updated for around three months. I'm fairly certain that Jason has said he wont let babies ride in carts, but I'm definitely certain that he's already fixed rabbit bones. So I'm going to assume this is dead, but my question is what came first? Did Jason stop using it because it wasn't very popular or productive? Or is it shamefully smaller than the forums because Jason doesn't use it as much?
So, thoughts? Preferably from Jason himself, but you know. Not trying to say anything, just asking questions and trying to see if things are as they appear to be.
Well, I DO want to avoid artificially rewarding any kind of behavior. I'm not looking to create a "gold star" system here.
Part of the thesis of the game is that these things need no reward, because of the inherent nature of human reality. Not "human nature" outside the game, but the very structure of the game itself (individual lives are limited, etc.).
The "reward" comes in the form of existence as opposed to oblivion.
But in a "curse war," both sides can screw the other side with no way to remedy it. If your ten buddies curse me, and my ten buddies curse you, well, we're both cursed for a long time, and there's no way to repair it.
But if we each get one curse to give and one blessing to give, per life, then we can counteract this kind of thing. A curse war becomes pointless, then.
I get that, then I am in favor of this kind of system.
I am in favor of scrapping the bonus points idea. This is about giving us ways to affect griefers in a way that they can't escape after their life with us. It is not about rewarding players for being decent human beings. Every person should be trustable, which means there should not be tiers of people: the normal ones, and the good angels above.
But why not also give incentive for going above and beyond the norm, if you have the chance? It's not about rewarding players for being decent human beings. It's about rewarding those that go beyond the bare minimum and promoting a culture where people are more than just decent. Like the person that spends their whole life teaching, and helping others. The idea is to try to promote a culture where people are more than just decent.
But that's just some thoughts for discussion. Not saying in favor of or against.
I don't like it requiring a name. It just means that all a griefer needs to do is wait until they're nameless and go to town for free.
First, how are they going to wait until they're nameless? Are you meaning that someone is going to run from their mom so they don't get named, or are you saying that someone is going to keep spawning until someone raises them without a name?
Obviously you have to get named if your mom wants to name you, either that or starve. And besides, if someone is nameless, it would lead to distrust and possibly even being killed. I think you're working under the assumption that nameless people would still be treated the same as they are before this system, and I'm disagreeing with that notion.
forestglade wrote:
The Nameless poeple being able to get around it though.... That seems way too easy to game. Babies can easily jump off mothers, it's happened several times when I'm naming someone.Yes. griefer will do that.
Then you don't raise the kid, especially considering it takes a food bar to pick them back up. SIMPLE.
Honestly, I like how it makes naming much more important. Right now, it's just kind of nice, but now there'd be real consequences to not naming your kids. Especially with the tutorial, there should be no reason for not naming your kids. I see a future where unnamed kids go unfed and unnamed adults are shunned or even killed, (including mothers that aren't naming their kids) but I'm not convinced that's a bad thing. I think it would go a long way to making names more important.