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a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building

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#401 Re: Main Forum » i’m a griefer magnet » 2019-04-27 15:20:25

futurebird wrote:

(This is why I don't have a problem with role players. They ARE invested at least.)

I feel the same way. RPers are OK. Even though I tend to stay out of it myself, to avoid Death by Drama...

I have been killed a couple of times when I actually enjoyed it, but I won't repeat the stories here so as not to encourage griefers.


Oblong originally wrote:

how do i deal with griefers without doing some griefing myself?

Good question.
I have not ended up griefing myself.

I guess my main advice would be to simply take a pause when it gets too bad, and remind yourself that if you grief, you're getting revenge on people who may never have harmed you at all.

Take pride in being a better person than the griefers.

#402 Re: Main Forum » Scarlet Letter » 2019-04-27 15:10:13

Someone said in another thread that people would kill just to get the "cool" letters. Apparently anything that visually separates someone from others is a motivation to grief, not a detriment.

#403 Re: Main Forum » Changes to the game that could make griefing harder » 2019-04-27 14:27:15

Another suggestion:

- A dedicated server for people who enjoy griefing and being griefed, where the game mechanics work as now but without cursing (and auto-cursing)

On this server, turn off decay, so griefers and wannabe-victims don't need to spend too much time building a civilization.
Maybe even domestic berry bushes should work like wild ones and never die out.

#404 Main Forum » Changes to the game that could make griefing harder » 2019-04-27 14:21:24

CatX
Replies: 19

There's been a lot of suggestions on changes to the game that could make griefing harder.

I'm not sure whether this has been discussed:
Auto-curse anyone who kills two times within a set period, maybe 15 minutes.
There shouldn't be a need to kill more often than that if you're only getting rid of griefers.

Other suggestions I've seen:

- Make murder not possible
- Make it harder to murder someone, i.e. it takes two stab wounds
- Ban known griefers from the game (they'll buy new accounts, but at least Jason gets more money from them)

There's many suggestions on what people can do ingame too, but I thought this could be a thread to discuss possible changes to the game mechanics.

#405 Re: Main Forum » Here Goes Another Killing Spree! » 2019-04-27 14:11:20

seth wrote:
CatX wrote:

I'm more and more supporting those who think griefers should be banned from this forum.

Honestly, private property sounds like a decent line of protection from griefers. If towns people have safe places they can run to and regroup (without fear of getting locked in) then they're probably more able to organize and fend off an attack..

We have no way of knowing when a griefer is born into our families.

Maybe private property could work to weed out griefers if we surrounded the whole town, make sure all knives are in backpacks, and only let old people smith and leave town. Then they can't make knives or arrows.

But it's not a method that will work in practice.

#406 Re: Main Forum » Auntie French Fry, and mysterious population declines » 2019-04-27 14:02:54

I was there about the same time, if it was the Aaberg family!
I had two daughters, but I later found their bones. They died as kids. Probably should have asked them if they were new...

A bear was loose north of town in my old years.

I don't play with the mod, so I have no way of telling for certain if a big town is on the decline.

Thank you for the fries, I had a taste late in my life smile

#407 Main Forum » I helped a new player today » 2019-04-27 13:44:23

CatX
Replies: 11

I helped a new player today.

It was his second life. He was killed in the first one.

I showed him how to make compost. Then how to farm carrots and wheat. I told him to carry a pie in his backpack, and always bring food with him if he could. I showed him other things he could eat besides berries, like milk and stew.

Not bragging. I just decided to show the community that some of us do like helping.
Maybe the griefer threads can be buried in threads like this one.

What good did you do today?

#408 Re: Main Forum » Here Goes Another Killing Spree! » 2019-04-27 13:30:23

"Congratulations" on killing off people who didn't even know what they were up against.
Carrot farmers, bakers and blacksmiths. My my.

What a failure this Toxic guy is. Give me Starcraft over your stupidity any day. There people develop skills and fight each other because that's what the game is about.

I'm more and more supporting those who think griefers should be banned from this forum.

#409 Re: Main Forum » Another biome specialization idea » 2019-04-27 11:21:36

I'm not suggesting this as a way to fix the "different kinds of people"-idea.
I'm just suggesting it as a way to get people to spread out a little.
So - game as is, but with a little water in the center of each biome, where people can build deep wells or pumps.
It wouldn't give towns from the get-go, but it would enable outposts in every biome.

#410 Re: Main Forum » Another biome specialization idea » 2019-04-27 11:03:52

How about adding just one water source in the center of all biomes (except swamps, leave them as is)?

Eves might not choose to live there. But once a city is up and running, it would make it simple for Eve's descendants to expand to nearby areas.
It would be worth it to have a small town in rabbit biome, since clothes decay and rabbits respawn.
If mines respawned as well, that too might be a good place for a small outpost that could grow into something bigger.
Same with snow, if seals respawned.

#411 Re: Main Forum » Creative solutions to the storage and clutter 'problems' » 2019-04-26 18:32:49

Food tables would make it so much easier for new players to quickly recognize what they can eat.

#412 Re: Main Forum » Since Jason says that every town should have a griefer I became one » 2019-04-26 15:52:53

breezeknight wrote:

@futurebird
all i ever said about griefing in OHOL is
that it is more fun to grief in OHOL than it is to be constructive
constructivity in OHOL ends up inevitably in frustration
because the game lacks any !!! appreciation for being constructive

What kind of appreciation for being constructive could be built into the game?

#413 Re: Main Forum » Since Jason says that every town should have a griefer I became one » 2019-04-26 15:36:28

breezeknight wrote:
jasonrohrer wrote:

Maintaining order is something to strive for, and gives life meaning.

Without the threat of at least some chaos, ....

great

so, where is the ORDER in OHOL again ?

all i see is chaos


- - -


Good point

"The second law of thermodynamics can be stated in terms of entropy. If a reversible process occurs, there is no net change in entropy. In an irreversible process, entropy always increases, so the change in entropy is positive." (According to Google anyways)

So as long as there are irreversible processes in OHOL, meaning there's something that can't be undone, then there will always be more chaos created. No griefers necessary.

(But don't take my word for it, I'm not a student of physics :-o )

#414 Re: Main Forum » Another biome specialization idea » 2019-04-26 12:46:45

Vexenie wrote:
CatX wrote:

Really? Then I learned something new big_smile

The update or the banged flat ingot tongue

Actually I think I misunderstood.

I thought the core idea was that "only smiths can make stuff, and they have to practice in order to build their skill before they can become smiths", i.e. you have to melt a certain amount of ingots before you can move up the tech tree and get the 'smith' skill which in turn will allow you to attempt to make a shovel. That sounds like a pain when life only lasts one hour.

And then I thought that in your reply you meant that if you hit a hammer head an extra time with a round rock, it also becomes flat/a shovel.
I've actually never tried to hit it twice, so I actually don't know what happens!

But now I realize that you tried to explain something else, and that we do have to make a hammer first before we can make a shovel, and I probably haven't grasped the core idea in this thread at all smile

#415 Re: Main Forum » Another biome specialization idea » 2019-04-26 09:34:47

Really? Then I learned something new big_smile

#416 Re: Main Forum » Another biome specialization idea » 2019-04-26 09:13:02

+1 to cereal

As for personalized tech trees, I think it works well in other games where your life isn't limited to one hour. But in OHOL, part of the challenge is to do what is needed to make the village thrive and survive. If the town needs a shovel ASAP - or say a water pump, and you know how to make one, I don't think you should be barred from it because you've been hunting rabbits until now.

If the conditions were such that people could start villages in every biome (and if iron mines were renewable) (and if road building was a little simpler) I think people would start more diverse towns and travel more between them.

I believe there's only one thing really needed to start a town anywhere:
- Kids need to be able to be productive while not starving to death

That's it, I think. That's all any biome needs to provide to create some ingame diversity.

#417 Re: Main Forum » Anyone else miss rabbit skin pouches? » 2019-04-26 08:46:35

Well... why shouldn't we be able to carry soil in rabbit pouches, though...?
Maybe Jason can humor us?

#418 Re: Main Forum » Since Jason says that every town should have a griefer I became one » 2019-04-26 08:37:44

Léonard wrote:

I still don't think using the /die command is comparable to griefing.

I agree with Léonard here.

People use /die to get a say in what town to spend the next hour.
It is an expression of wanting to have a free choice.

It sucks, but it could be fixed by implementing some sort of choice system in the login menu. Perhaps it would be enough to choose generation (0-5 or above).

Griefing on the other hand is an expression of malicious intent.
If we take away murder, they will lure in bears. If we take away killer bears, they will hide all the food. Where does one even begin to find a solution to that problem..?
Griefing can't be 'fixed' the way /die-babies can be fixed, but maybe it can be limited.

I don't /die, and I don't grief, but I can respect /die-babies.
I can't respect griefers.

#419 Re: Main Forum » Anyone else miss rabbit skin pouches? » 2019-04-26 08:09:47

It would work perfectly if bowls weren't needed to distribute soil.

But I love the idea.

Also fun: You could technically start a carrot farm without a forge, as long as you have soil, rabbit, and water. You can use a backpack to carry soil, so you don't actually need a basket either. You can't split the soil piles though, so a lot of soil goes to waste, but it is doable.

#420 Re: Main Forum » Nerf the number of ponds in one location. » 2019-04-26 07:45:05

When I run around, I often find places with only a few ponds. I've been in several starter villages located near 3 ponds or less, because the Eve had to settle at some point. Perhaps the issue is that only the camps near large clusters of ponds manage to survive long enough to develop tech.

#421 Re: Main Forum » Since Jason says that every town should have a griefer I became one » 2019-04-26 07:42:37

Empty spaces, what are we living for?
Demolished places, I guess we know the score
On and on, does anybody know what we are playing for?
Another griefer, another mindless crime
Behind the keyboard, in the OHOL land
Hold the line, does anybody want to take it anymore?

We must game on...

#422 Re: Main Forum » GRIEFERS SHOULD BE BANNED! » 2019-04-25 09:22:25

JonySky wrote:

I do not like ruining anyone's experience ... but nobody should tell me how I should play OHOL

...

there are enough methods to counteract the griefers in the game ... but I think lazy players prefer to complain and continue working as robots, rather than solve the problem themselves, then end up in these forums to complain

Your argument seems faulty to me.

"If I dislike spending my time dealing with griefers, I should have the option to farm carrots instead and just stay out of the drama... Nobody should tell me how I should play OHOL"
See how your argument works both ways?

Carrot farmers aren't lazy. That is just another lame griefer excuse for being a jerk.

The difference is that the carrot farmer, unlike the griefer, *really* doesn't destroy anyone else's fun.
The difference is that the griefer *does* end up imposing his play style on the carrot farmer.

If, as you say, you want to have fun, and you don't like ruining anyone's experience, then stop perpetuating those silly excuses. Let's help each other instead by brain storming and perhaps coming up with good ideas for Jason to implement that benefit all, regardless of preferred play style.

#423 Re: Main Forum » GRIEFERS SHOULD BE BANNED! » 2019-04-25 08:42:45

Toxic wrote:

ohol is a fun game and I enjoy it my way you enjoy it your way.


The dilemma of this game as I see it:

If I want to learn how to become a master chef, and you want to hunt a thousand rabbits, we don't get in each other's way.
If I want to be the best mom ever, and you want to build a car, we don't get in each other's way.
If I want to make boxes and baskets and tidy up the town, and you want to hang around the by fire and roleplay, we don't get in each other's way.
For the most part, anyways.

But if I want either of the ones above, and you want to randomly kill me, or kill all females, or just wreak havoc, it's no longer an issue of each being able to choose their own fun. Griefing necessarily imposes on other people's fun.

It would be a different matter if this was meant to be a pvp game. But it's not meant to be that. Most don't play it that way, but the few who do enforce their play style on others.

Now to some degree, Toxic, I can see your point that griefers stress test the system and point out the weaknesses. But if that's the main value of griefing, then we can't at the same time ignore the grief griefing brings about with a light-hearted "He's having fun his way". If that's the main value, then it follows that these are areas where the game needs fixing, because what's happening is not OK.

And I realize many have opinions on "how the game is meant to be played", and people will naturally interpret Jason's decisions as the developer differently. My take is that Jason seems to strive for a game that's "almost like real life", and in real life there aren't that many serial killers and town wreckers. I would imagine that in real life stone age or bronze age, the main threats came from the environment and from other groups, and that people destroying societies from within was the exception to the rule. I would imagine that the bonds people get to their mothers, their families, their cities, make them more inclined to further the society's interests as a whole than thwart it.

I realize that the game might never get there though, because lives in OHOL don't matter the same way our real lives matter. In real life, we (or very few claim otherwise) don't have memories of other lives. In OHOL, we know that when we die, we get a new start elsewhere. This difference is something Jason can never do anything to mitigate, and it means that griefing in OHOL will always be at a level that is more than probably most, certainly me, wants.

But maybe we should ask you, since you're such a prominent griefer:
What could be done in the game to make it more interesting for people like you to further society's interests instead of thwarting it?

#424 Re: Main Forum » Can we just ban people from forum and discord who brag about griefing? » 2019-04-24 16:25:35

Ace wrote:

Some people don't like when the map gets too cluttered with camps and want to make an apocalypse. In this case it's actually griefing to stop those people you call "griefers" since what they work for is for the greater good of that time.

Actually, the map is nearly infinite. You may not like being born into towns, but you always have the option to leave and start a brand new town elsewhere.

I have more respect for a person who says "I invoked an apocalypse because I had fun working towards it" than for a person who makes excuses like that.

#425 Re: Main Forum » Icecream cart? Making an icecream factory now. » 2019-04-24 14:27:54

Let them eat cake! Uh, Let them eat ice cream!

I support ice cream factories.

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