a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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I'm just gonna post this here, since I think it quite relevant to the situation at hand:
https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/tscc3e5 … y-pacifism
+1 Insightful
It isn't against the law to call someone whatever you want. At least not in the USA,
Of course it is, you don't know the law in your own country:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation
There are this kind of laws in all civilized countries, e.g. in EU:
"Defamation laws may come into tension with freedom of speech, leading to censorship or chilling effects where publishers fear lawsuits. Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights permits restrictions on freedom of speech when necessary to protect the reputation or rights of others."
people have been recorded calling Bill Clinton a
rapist at his rallies. People called Obama a nigger all the time also a terrorist sympathizer and secret Muslim. People call trump all
sorts of fun stuff, like Hitler and whatever.
1. There are special rules for public figures.
2. It's civil offence not criminal, so it's up to plaintiff to decide whether to sue or not.
Also killing someones video game character is not illegal in the USA either.
No, it isn't. But we're not talking about that. Try to stand in the middle of busy street next to the cop and start shouting profanities. Tell us how it went. You most likely will be charged with disturbing the peace:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breach_of_the_peace
"Disturbing the peace is a crime generally defined as the unsettling of proper order in a public space through one's actions. This can include [...] disturbing others by [...] using profanity."
You can turn off the game if you don't like the people you are playing with. You can make your own invite only server and kick out people who offend you or get reported to whatever organization you set up.
The lineage server is also on github so you can have your custom server link the accounts to email people use to sign up to your server with the lives lived. I believe the game log folder records player chat so you should be able to use that in your reporting system.
I have better idea. Let the people that break the law start their own private server. Why I should flee, not them?
I remember having an excess of mutton in one fairly large village, but literally a solid 70% of the plates were locked in a room and nobody had the key lmao. I don't even know why the fuck they were all in there. There were baskets full of plates and bowls in that room, along with bow and arrows and knives.
I can understand locking up the weapons and maybe files, but all those plates and bowls and baskets had no reason being in that giant [6 by 6 at least] locked room. Probs was a griefer or some shit.
Locked room with weapons, full gear and food = 100% griefer preparing for next killing spree. Seen it more than once, even with locked horse. Maybe he was too lazy to make pies and waited for others to produce stuff for him first?
I stopped asking around for the key when some asshole started telling people to kill me because I wasn't working lmao.
You were bad slave. You should have known your place.
It's infeasible - you cannot automate it. There are no simple rules that decide whether some action is good or bad. Heck, even people in game frequently have different opinions. Like should we keep kids or not:
- Kill all new kids, famine is imminent.
- We're are low on females, I can go forage.
And what if then she doesn't go forage?
And what if then somebody brings a cartload of mutton?
And what if then we don't have fire for making pies?
And what...
Dude every single time killing gets nerfed, it is only a few days before people start to whine and call for more nerfs.
I suppose I could have said "they are never going to be happy" though.
For very low values of "never":
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 981#p19981
"So if your town gets wiped out by mass murderer, it's really your fault now. If anything, I may think that it has been actually nerfed too much (with extended slowdown, etc.)."
there are the censor player speech threads,
For things that could get them prosecuted IRL if they said it in public place. What's wrong with that?
suggestions to censor the forum,
Forum is already censored. You've seen that spam posts dissapearing, didn't you? Or would you prefer to protect "spammer rights" and have more spam than content on the forum?
veiled suggestions to ban players threads.
Not veiled at all. Assholes should have accounts suspeneded. They are on purpose spoiling fun for a lot of people.
They are all really part of the same thing whether the participants know it or not. It is the allegorical type as those who in politics clamor for ever more and more top down control of our lives.
So how about bottom up control? If there were mechanism in the game for me to say "I don't wan't to play with this player - he's asshole". Effect would be that he cannot spawn in games I'm playing and I cannot spawn in games that he is playing. That's how social ostracism work IRL. Would you support it or oppose it?
The abusive players in this game can make the game really off-putting.
I think there should be a way to report other players. If someone consistently comes up with reports, then they get an IP and account suspension or something.
+1
That's kind of standard for games that have chat between players. There is report link beneath each post on this forum, that can get accounts banned. Something similar should be also in game.
1. How does home marker work, why it doesn't show up every time?
You inherit any home marker that is on the screen when you are born. If there is none, you must set one yourself.
2. Did anybody else experience the same bug I had - wrong direction arrow?
That's probably distant town's bell. You hear it at ~30s into the game.
3. I know the map is big, but how big is it?
I theory infinite. In practice distance between villages/tows I've seen in replays is about 14000-40000 tiles. You run at about 3 tiles/s, so 14000 is more than hour of pure running (no stop for eating, etc.).
I mean, what's the point of having a map so large, that even wasting all my life I wasn't able to track any human activity (not even speaking of alive towns)
Because Jason hates us. No, he wanted to prevent Eves from settling in town's ruins. But as a side effect he killed any possibility of interaction between towns.
Why should the world be sanitized for your sensitivity?
If somebody is throwing slurs at you IRL it's misdemeanor / disorderly conduct and he can be prosecuted. Majority of people didn't like this kind behaviour and made a law to stop it. That's why.
No one has to endure anything in any game, ever. I assume your computer has a power button.
That's very good idea. Only the power button should be pressed on computer of the person breaking the law, not his victim.
I kinda agree with JonySky. Spam and offensive messages on the forum gets deleted. Similarly throwing slurs in game at other players should get the account suspended.
The problem is that the town was already too cluttered with mutton. Just like most of towns with sheep I've been to. People just fill up pens with slaughtered sheep and they never bother clearing them.
We don't need as much poop with the new improved compost, so higher cost wouldn't ruin it.
You cannot just look at the steady state. Have you tried to restart compost cycle after a famine? Nerfing compost may make it nearly impossible. And have you been in a town with too much milkweed lately? That costs soil too.
And the cost of wool is too high because I just got murdered for shearing a sheep while there was still a mouflon in the pen.
Just feed the lamb. What's the problem? Compost is a lifeline of the town. Fucking with it may make shepherd mad. And he has a knife... Just bad life choices.
the cost is too high
Since when bowl of berries + one carrot is too high cost?
I've seen something like that in the past. Griefers often have 2-3 different accounts, so they are not affected by lineage ban.
I am not saying you HAVE to know everything, I am not saying that being in a town without knowing how it was created is a bad thing, i am just saying you should know the steps to how the village was made.
What's wrong with learning this over time?
You can surprisingly get far in the current stage of the game as an eve, I am sure I am not the only one who has managed to get compost going or steel tools as an eve,
I've seen steel tools maybe once or twice. With lucky spawn of very experienced players. Never seen sheep pen. Heck, even most villages don't have one.
All I am saying is its EASIEST to learn the game to start as an eve and work your way up through the tech tree, it's less overwhelming and you can work at your on pace,
Anything but. Early on you're almost always on the brink of starvation. And it's usually so hectic, that nobody can teach you anything. Early camps are the most hostile places to learn new things that you have in the game.
The game isn't about "going back to the old town you were in so you can complete that house" AND it isn't about "Finding the big towns so i can learn or see future tech", Its about starting in whatever condition you are put in and teching up from there.
Yes. I agree. And that's why I learned how to make buckets and deep wells, before making tools necessary for them. I just got born into situation where they were needed and tools already available. With your linear learning approach I should've wasted iron making duplicate tools with people starving left and right, due to lack of water.
you should always know how to replace the tool you are using, or recreate something.
Society functions perfectly well with people having no clue how to recreate tools they are using. Somebody else does know. But in exchange they usually don't know how to make things I'm producing.
Preventing New players from spawning into thriving villages would help the game alot. just think of it as a boot camp.
The most profound effect of that would be driving 90%+ of them away, before they learned enough to spawn into village. Retention rate is already pretty low as it is. You want to make it way worse.
Now back to the baby suicide.
Why do babies kill themselves:
[...]
From my own experience and from what I'm reading on the forum, I guess the no. 1 resason is: I have enough Eve/Eve's child runs for today - they all look nearly the same, that's just boring.
Maybe looking at Eve deaths EG how many players spawn as eves and suicide would give some info about how many players are cycling. as normally Eves who want to play normally survive a while but babys are less resistant.
The most frequent reason of Eve suicide for me is: can't find even minimally viable spot for camp after constantly running for couple minutes. Got tired after three runs without place to set up camp and don't wanna play Eve anymore today.
The last few weeks baby suicided haven't been that bad, it's more that there are dumb children not knowing how to play.
And towns are best places for teaching them how to do stuff. Eve camps are the worst.
you mentioned a spawn UI for babies to choice, please don't do that either.
That's not me.
We just need to find a way that prevents players spawning at better places if they die early. you should have to work to get there, that was my general thought around my mentioned idea (it would give people a out of game reason, not to kill themselves and it would be a leveling system of sorts, which is what we are really playing for "To see that highest level")
Eve camps are the highest level of difficulty.
This will give people only a reason for quitting the game. That's BTW what lineage ban is achieving. I can only spawn as Eve or Eve's child now, but don't feel like it? Stop playing for a while.
And being an eve is the best way to learn,
Only basic stuff. How I'm supposed to learn how to make a cart, compost or knife as Eve?
there is no point being born into a town with advanced stuff for you to learn when you will rarely see it
Towns are not meant to be a rare thing or are they?
you are best learning start to finish.
You need to know some basic stuff, that's true. But later on order is completely irrelevant. You do what's necessary at the moment. I've made lots of buckets, deep wells, boxes and carts, but probably never made a froe or a saw myself. I could look it up, if I really needed, but it hasn't been necessary so far. I made a lot of compost, but never made a pen, etc.
That's the whole point, right? you have to know how to live as an eve so you can progress from being and eve to the next stage and so on. The end game is ment to be a rare case where not many people know the recipes etc.. imagine it as a graph. knowledge of each "age" should be in a decreasing trend.
I disagree. You can be very productive member of town, without knowing how to make most of things there. That what's cool about specialization and cooperation. IRL you also use many many things successfully, without having a clue how to make them. You eat bread every day. Do you know how to bake it? You are using computer. Can you assemble one yourself? Do you know how to catch and perpare tuna fish? But you've eaten one.
Hahaha oh, obviously you'd be able to spawn as second gen, that would be ridiculous otherwise.
Then the problem will be at third gen. Lineage ban is hitting towns hard already. You idea will obliterate villages before they have a chance to become towns.
Besides, I don't see you offering any suggestions.
I am, just not in this thread.
How to make bigger biomes interesting and towns different: https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 329#p19329
New challenges in towns, instead of making basic stuff hard: https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 240#p18240
There absolutely needs to be something done about the way things are now, after all.
Playing in towns gets boring as shit pretty quickly,
I had the most fun playing in towns. You can do so many different things there. Actually Eve runs (even successful ones) are way more boring - you always need to do nearly the same things.
but anything else ends up being basically singleplayer because 9/10 eve-born babies promptly top themselves.
I haven't seen 90% mortality rate for a long time. I usually end up with 3-5 alive kids. If everybody suicides on you, maybe you need to search for a problem (and solution) in a mirror?
What works for me.
How to keep alive first kid that is spawned as soon as you start as Eve? Quickly name yourself, name him, start temp running. About 50% of kids will stay with you seeing that. And that are usually more experienced players. If you find nice spot they will be old enough to help you immediately. Win-win. Noobs will suicide within first minute of running. Just pick up next born kid.
Any kid that is born while I already carry one - I don't even stop to say sorry. I feel bad about it, but if I stop temp running, I'll waste food and most likely run out of time to find nice spot. So just stopping to say SRY will cost my life and my other kid's life.
If I can't find good spot in 4-5 minutes I just give up, say "sry bad spawn" and suicide. Setting a camp in bad place will end up with everybody dying in 2-3 gens anyway. And searching longer than that will loose too many kids, so most likely no third gen at all.
Good spot: mandatory border of desert, so people can work and stay alive not burning through food at insane rate. Close ponds, close green biome with lots of food, fairly close tule/clay, fairly close rabbits, close cacti a big bonus.
Next step is to make few baskets, set up adobe kiln and few wet bowls. From then on I keep EVERY kid that is born. And routine with each one is pretty similar. Usually I immediately stop working, grab a kid and move to warm spot. Then introduce him/her to situation.
- Just started, good spot, wanna live?
- Y
- You are Martin
Green SW, water tule SE, rabbits N, cacti NE. If famine imminent, E is also good direction to go. Now I run around to show you.
Then I run around, showing things, with main focus being food - where, how far and how much is there (so if closest bushes are empty he knows exactly where to run and how much time he'll need).
- J O B?
- Take basket, go forage, stay alive, bring some food and seeds if you can, so I can finish setting up the farm. Rope and other usefull things are nice too.
Between kids I focus on setting up a dozen or two rows of planted and watered farm. Things like rope for fire bow, hatchet, etc. are usually brought by kids. There are bunch of kids that will die foraging, but that's good too. If they don't know how to forage, they are just too new to be able to help at this stage of camp anyway.
There was also very nice thread with good ideas about keeping kids as Eve alive here:
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=1892
Rebel wrote:Putting a mad idea out there (crazy I know), how about you have to earn the right to spawn in long family lines.
EG your first life will be an eve, if you live to old age (50+) you can then spawn as baby of an eve, live to old age you can spawn as the 3rd gen etc etc.. notice is said CAN, if there are no 3rd gens you will spawn in a lower one. Every life you die between the ages of let's say 14 and 40, you then go down a generation.
I know this won't work and totally is against the scope of the game but it was fun thinking about it, kinda makes a leveling system and long lines would be more pro players and what not.Oooh, personally I kinda like this idea. There's definitely potential there!
Totally awful idea. All towns will die off because no kids will be born. Even early game will suck. You spawn as Eve, find a nice spot, build a camp. No kids can be born yet as second gen, so you die alone. Another try, you don't find viable spot in time, so what now? Stand by the bush for 45 minutes, doing nothing, just not to lose you "priviledge" to spawn as 2nd gen? And what about new players? You never can be born into town. You are doomed to be eternal Eve, unless you learn everything on your own.
I was in a fledgling town today, gen 5. I spent my entire life making food and tools and fetching stuff. When I was forty-fiftyish, we had gone from zero tools to axe, shovel, hoe, froe, pick and adze, we were making stew, and all that along with teaching some new players stuff.
It took one person. One. To end it all.
He didn't need to prepare. He didn't need to do anything. He just made a bow and arrow and killed all four fertile women. He even hung around camp most of the time. We couldn't defend ourselves, because all milkweed was depleted.
I don't care if it's realistic (which it isn't), or what have you. One person being able to destroy the effort of ten other people in a heartbeat is fucked up. It's bad game design.
I've earned the prestigious award for being a "chief complainer about griefing" on this forum. I know how you feel and symphatize with you. But I also think it's all your fault here (by "you" I mean the whole village). Not having a bow and arrow for defense at 5th gen? Really? I feel insecure if I don't have one late 2nd/early 3rd gen.
And how could he kill four women? Even 3yo kid can steal the arrow. Nobody had this idea? What I did in similar situation? I stole arrow, went to make a bow, griefer had to go to make another arrow. Then we met again, but both of us with armed bows. Even if he could manage to kill me (which he didn't), somebody else could take my bow and kill him back. Problem solved.
Milkweed depleted? I plant milkweed like crazy from 2nd gen - that's necessary anyway to replace all the stone hoes before you get to steel tools. One stone hoe on average will tile fully (twice) only 5 rows in addition to 4 necessary for milkweed to get the next one.
The whole point of Jason's idea is instead of having derpy NPC, that pose no real challenge, is to have real griefers as crimnals. Which I like a lot. So griefers are not going anywhere. You need not only to secure food, but also prepare defense as well. And I'm completely fine with that, as long as griefers don't have OP tools and you have fair chance to defend from them. Town has to defend against every single griefer, but griefer needs to win only once to wipe out town. So it shouldn't be easy to cause massive damage.
This is just for people like BreezeKnight and Sc0rp always complaining about griefing. Violance is a thing that you need to accept, It's kill or be killed.
I've been on both ends of the knife, I've been killed plenty but it's not a big deal to me. Just respawn and start a new life, Build a new town if you have to. Nothing will last forever in this game even if there was everlasting peace towns would eventually die out.
You shouldn't expect every town to peaceful, You probably will be killed for your backpack and your right shoe. Perhaps next time you will take precautions to keep the knife away from crazy lunatics. You should remain vigilant at all times, Don't hang around people with weapons out. Don't stand still. If someone is suspicious or anti-social then you should definitely kill them first.
Anyway don't feel disheartened if your murdered, It's just a game after all.
You kind of misreading what I'm saying. I'm not complaining about griefing per se, but only instances where griefing is OP - i.e. where noob griefer in few minutes can wipe out the whole town or make it unhabitable or cause problems that will take two generations to fix without any viable way to prevent it by the people building the town. There are still few things like that, but with each version fewer and fewer. E.g. with recent changes, where you can target murderer hiding behing the tree, mass murder should be pretty easy to counter. So if your town gets wiped out by mass murderer, it's really your fault now. If anything, I may think that it has been actually nerfed too much (with extended slowdown, etc.).
I still don't know for example how to protect usefull trees in green biome. Cutting them basically makes whole town unhabitable after a while. And you can cut the trees very very quickly, which means that somebody needs to be standing there just looking over them for 20 gens/20h straight, which is kind of very boring gameplay, so no real hope that anybody will be doing it. Maybe we should make cutting them more difficult (multistep, like uprooting berry bushes), so you have to check only once in a while.
Poking one or two bear caves, luring bears into camp and shooting fleeing people in the back in early 2nd/3rd gen village is another example of something that I don't have a clue how to defend against. And when I asked, nobody suggested anything sensible.
kubassa wrote:Glassius wrote:Iron age started about 1200 BC. Bandaging was described 2200 BC. The oldest evidence for treppaning is about 6500 BC. Tooth drilling 7000 BC. Neanderthal are known for nursing injuried and sick. It is definitely not to early in game for medicine.
Ya ok idiot......................
This has to be one of the stupidest things i have read. EVER.Why?
Ignore him. It's just a moron calling other people idiots - just scan his other posts.
Cool!
Some people like you are constantly crying about griefing and killing and how the game is dying.
And you are constantly saying that griefing is utmost fun for all people involved, which is utter nonsense. Like 90% of people playing this game with you had bad experience.
Your the ones causing people to stop playing by distorting the truth and saying that things are worse then they are.
+1 Blame the victim
2-3 games per day with griefers in them for a week and a peak of 5 or 6 killed the game for me. Then, few days later, when I tried to play again, I got born to griefer in first game. Haven't played since. YMMV. And with the number of people playing and how plenty of things griefer can do have no counters, it takes just one bad apple to spoil the whole bunch.
I'll be doing you a favor by killing off the leeches.
That's disfavor for me.
Go on Neo, keep killing people. Until you're the only one playing on the server. That will be mighty fun.
Yes! Please make a suicide button (that isn't easy to accidentally click). I have wasted SO MUCH TIME suiciding, and aggro-ing bears to die (sorry towns).
You can do it faster: ESC + % to quit and relaunch the game.
Yeah, I think that Eve/early camps should be protected from griefers (most likely with karma system or abitlity to mob up). There are myriad ways to grief at this stage (as I pointed out in "How to grief effectively" topic) and nobody here come up with ways to defend against them so early on (despite me asking). Game is impossibly rigged at this stage in favour of griefers.