a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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Since the rift was removed its felt like we have gotten layers upon layers of weird mechanics to combat the unlimited maps potential for resources. Love the rift or hate the rift, its hard to argue that it wasnt a great testing ground. The main issue i saw with it was its size. Balancing the game around that amount of space doesn't translate well to an infinite map.
That said i think if sizes were experimented with along side mechanical balancing we could see some good results. Say for example the rift returned, and it started out small. Then gradually got bigger after each arc ended. Eventually it would be as big as the current space most families occupy collectively now. Which i think we can all agree is a little too big. It would help with finding that goldy locks zone for a lot of elements of this game that need adjustments.
It's not a bug it's a glitch.
Very disapointing that he decided to test the idea of non infinite map by making it a small rift box which obviously ended up in a disaster, if he tested it properly it would have been very different and we wouldnt have half of the shitty mechanics we have right now since they are there to artificially create what a realistic map naturally does.
I agree with this 100%. The rift was way too small to be viable. That said when resources started to run low you saw some very interesting behavior from families. Some would steal, some would hoard. People made fortresses on the corners or the map that would house several different families in the lifetime of the arc. People would get run out of their home by invaders and have to raise their family in the woods until things calmed down. Some families lived together in peace and protected each other while others were constant rivals and warred with each other throughout the arc. There was a group of people who wanted to keep the arc going and others who wanted to end it. Not just for the sake of destruction but for the sake of a fresh start, which eventually everyone was ready for.
But the box was way too small. I wish he had experimented with different sizes before just fully removing it. I enjoyed the last fam standing aspect of it. I always had a family i was more attached to each arc and worked hard to keep them around. But then came eve restrictions, memescore, tool slots, race restrictions, homeland mechanics, biome banding, and more. All things i felt were implemented to serve as a boundary, just like the rift. But did a much worse job than a literal wall could do. In the scheme of things banding brought back a lot of aspects of the rift. Except it does it wy worse. Instead of being trapped in a small box, we're trapped in an infinite tube and propelled along it indefinitely. I would take the box over that any day.
So yea its basically just a roadblock that was supposed to be interesting and make the game more dynamic. Then ended up failing on all accounts. As far as i see it, Jason's ideals and goals for this game far outweigh its capabilities. You cant just wish and intend for something to happen and just have it end up that way. This game isnt that complicated, its not dynamic. The only things that present any element of diversity is the people who play this game. Which has nothing to do with jason, even if he tried to claim it as such. Chat rooms serve basically the same function and there is no nuance with their design. Tech tree is linear, experiences are repeated, there is only one direction, only one way to do things. You have three choices when playing this game, do the thing, do nothing, or make it difficult for others to do the thing. The games hard dont get me wrong. But thats not because its even that complicated. Its because players are given no resources to learn the game and are just thrown in with nothing. Then anyone with some degree of knowledge is expected to teach them the game. Though i do find this form of interaction interesting. Its also wildly disrespectful and patronizing of jason to treat his player base like that and act like its "enlightened" or some bullshit. Its just being lazy and treating your audience like insects in your terrarium. And acting like you're a genius when you drop in a frog you caught by the lake to eat us, only to have it die and rotting in a matter of days or weeks.
There is so much wrong with this game. So many thing Jason refuses to see or acknowledge as problems because of his own pride and hubris. He has to presume hes right, and that we're all just idiots. Otherwise he will be forced to change, challenge himself, or admit he was wrong. Things i still hope he's capable of but doubt he is.
Race restrictions really only serve a couple purposes. First they force interactions between families when they wouldnt likely happen otherwise. Second they make resources seems more valuable considering the lengths one must go to get then. Third they limit how fast a family can progress through the tech tree.
The interactions are hollow and false. They are annoying and waste everyone's time. Traveling for 5-10 minutes just to chase people around with a pencil and paper asking for what you need is literally the stupidest thing ever. If you like this i seriously question your sanity.
Resource value is good, but that happens naturally. Surplus wealth is rare either way. And when it is it promotes raiding from other fams. Something that commonly happened in the past. Those kind of interactions were not hollow. They promoted the use of fortress cities and families being prepared to defend themselves from raiders and outside threats. This is one of the biggest parts of civilization and was removed from the game due to race restrictions.
But lastly, the main reason i think they were introduced. Was to slow down tech advancement. Families were able to hit late game a day or two after a server reset. This removed a lot of the different stages of a civilization after a certain time period. Every town was advanced, all of them had engines and oil. There wasn't much to do beyond farming and cooking. So i do understand the desired to space this out. But i do think there are more interesting ways to do that.
Eve spawns have always been a bit of a mess. Race restrictions have made it a lot worse because its a requirement that we get resources from each other. It was way better when families could be 10k away from each other and it didnt matter. It was fun seeing a culture begin to develop in individual towns and families instead of just "they're the jungle fam".
Its too easy to navigate now and the inter family system is just boring. Like you mentioned, having to walk thousands of tiles just to get some materials so you can make yellow dye or something is stupid. You end up spending a life or two just walking to get stuff and another life to do what you actually wanted to do. Language barrier makes this whole process even more annoying.
I hope Jason realizes that race restrictions have not added anything good to this game. They're not fun, they're not interesting, they dont make lives more unique. All they do is promote a lot of walking and wasted time to actually play the game. It turns families into a utility instead of an actually family or culture.
This is interesting.
I respect Dodge, I respect Morti, and i respect Spoon.
Dodge is the unapologetic critic. Sure he can be a bit on the jason end of things but most of all hes the devil's advocate. Especially in regards to spoon.
Good things if you acknowledge friction as growth.
Spoon is the unknown. The what if, the questionable perspective, and the unfounded theory. He pushes the thoughts surrounding this game into a dimension of its own. Sometime to his own accord but rarely in a vain effort. The life and discord surround this forum is alive because of spoon. Even if you hate him, even if you love him, he has contributed more to this community than anyone can hope to do. Sarcastic sheep not included.
Morti, oof, Morti, you are like looking at the sun directly without sunglasses. You look too long and too intently youll go blind. In your beauty you're dangerous. You're too idealistic, too sweet, too loving. All of it is too bright to read. I respect it dont get me wrong. But i feel its likely a desire to fill a hole in society you havent recieved in your own. To prove it exists and to be the person you wished existed in your own life.
I respect this most of all.
Its not easy to be an impossible person in a good way. But these three do it in their own. Are they perfect, no, are they doing their best, no doubt. Sure this is a small pond so its easy to look like a big fish. Dont let that get to your ego. Anyone. This game is trash and the people who criticize it and try to promote its growth are worth way more than someone who tries to plaster their clout in regarding to this game onto their ego. It doesnt mean anything and in a decade youll realize how much time was wasted doing nothing but feeding your own self importance.
As long as spoon gets to be the distant yandere to both of them im on board
Start doing lsd
Imagine yourself in black, its raining, you dont have an umbrella, surrounded by others. Some are crying. Some are laughing, some are just sitting there bored. You stare at the vacant abyss in front of you and watch a gilded box slowly lower inside. The box contains all your memories and experience of this game. Your eyes dart over to the vacant podium housing a small microphone. As the box begins to disappear from view some people begin to leave. A feeling of urgency comes over you and you're compelled to say something. Maybe its a farewell to times past, maybe its a rant about the pain you endured, the tears you shed, and the laughs you shared.
What do you say?
I mean jason hasnt patched the game at all in 2021. If he still plans to develop the game im sure we'll see some of the problems addressed. If not, *shrug*
Ive have had 2/6 of my github issues resolved right away, and the remaining sorted for when jason can get to them. Not a single post of mine has been rejected. The two that were resolved were done so because the issues needed to be resolved right away. Its not surprising jason puts others on the back burner when they're not game breaking.
But i guess there will always be a group of people to abuse mechanics just to prove a point to him and force his hand. Ruining the game for others in the mean time and justifying it because their tiny problem became a big one due to their efforts.
To reference the forums author. Reserving materials to maintain the servers wealth is a common trend. Just because someone is fencing them in on full display in town doesnt make them different than someone who does something similar in a far off outpost. The goals are the same. The issue i see is more that one syndicate of people want total governance over the resources of the server under their rules. Anyone else is an enemy even if they are doing the same thing, even if they're doing it more successfully.
Make a github post. Its the best way to resolve mechanical issues like this.
I think its funny how the eve mechanics were added because too many people wanted to be eve and abused the /die mechanic to be one. Now the people who dont want to be eve are being picked against their will and nobody wins. Grade A stuff.
Just ignore they exist or dump them in the nursery. If they're strong they'll find a way to survive.
Typical story of ohol. Its depressing but things are more often like this than they are not. Its also not surprising people were siding on the family consider planting trees and "gravekeeping" were the highlighted profession in this story.
Dont feel bad, males are disposable after all, so removing one only increases spawn weight for you family.
Most experienced players play with a strong sense of bias. Often outing to resume a project they had started in lives past, check in on a family they're invested in, or pick a family of the race they wish to play as.
It is what it is.
Eventually you will grow hardened to these elements and feel next to nothing when it happens. Depressing as it is its the way of the game.
Why do i always post on here when im blacked out drunk and forget i was even here?
I'm pretty sure i could guess who is doing this within five individuals. I bet you could too. I bet you could trace the IP and refer it to other active accounts. There are only a few people who follow the words of jason enough to abuse them, and by now we all know who they are. If they're using excessive expletives its easy to lump them into one group, but if they are not and just trolling the line its easy to presume they're the other group. We have seen folks toe the line countless times before just in spite of jason and to the detriment of all of us. To gratify their own existence like it actually matters. To make "change" instead of just emailing him or making a reasonable github report. You know who they are and you know how capable they are compared to the people who attempt to damage anything. I imagine who ever is doing this is akin to them. Someone who's willing to cut down all the juniper trees on the server to prove a point, someone who's willing to abuse property fences to enslave a 1/3 of the servers population, someone who would abuse broken mechanics to lock away valuable resources because they could. Sound familiar? We always ask why this community is so chaotic but we never choose to take responsibility for our impact on it, and our place as role models. Especially when we find a place of power, right?
It's funny to see how much people change when they're given even the remotest amount of power and responsibility. Its honesty sad. I hope you all realize how much you could enable things now that you can bend the ear. I hope that you do, instead of just bending over and forgetting who you were before everything. I know its "hard" to guess within the "large" amount of active daily players who could possibly be doing this. The fact ******, who i do have a very soft heart for, is backing them, should answer that. I wish you luck on your fruitless journey, and you should envy and resent the mods who handed off the baton to you after seeing the light.
RIP Jord, the only mod who held a balance and made a difference these past hellish years. Sad they're gone, but grateful they're in a better place.
Enjoy your hell, while you can fare the flames.
And to be honest. This game is not one to invite an emotionally stable environment in any regard. If you're looking to make an impact, make friends, build a stable society, or even teach it will be a struggle. When playing this game i suggest finding something you enjoy doing, doing it to the best of your abilities, and having fun. Dont take it too seriously and do what you can. Sometimes being selfish is necessary for accomplishing unobtainable goals. This can be harmful if not executed fully but you can make a huge difference for the server in a short amount of time by sacrificing your immediate responsibilities for the greater gain.
Obviously people might have problems with this but its far more cathartic than damaging the total environment due to spite.
Show them what you're capable of. Do it with pride. And slap them in their faces with your accomplishments. Its far more satisfying than hurting the server as a whole. Show your worth and never let it be denied. Even if you take it by illegitimate means.
Quirky i don't know how many times this has been. Every time you ask for forgiveness and everytime you explain your misconduct in excessive detail. I'm not sure if you want the attention for your actions and don't really care about their impact or actually seek redemption. In either case, i suggest finding healthier ways to self sooth and cope with unrest than a game like this. There are far more cathartic games that are built exclusively for that purpose. I suggest finding an outlet well suited for when you're struggling so you can vent in an environment that has openly accepted that behavior and come back to ohol when you feel more in tune with its social rhythm. No need making yourself an outcast and feeling guilty over and over again just to deal with stress. Find your outlet to vent with and come back to build your reputation off of the hard work we all know you're capable of.
Don't ask for forgiveness from others but ask better of yourself.
<3
I understand and appreciate necroing being acceptable. I've honestly been an advocate for it in the past. But when its used in no relevance, in order to drown out current posts it is damaging. Forum posts are rare these days. When you have one user drowning out and pushing those post into non trafficked areas you're signing the death warrant of these forums. I understand if its accepted in the rules. I appreciate that within reason. But just like posts are accepted in the rules, if someone posted over and over again on a forum to drown out others and disable communication within the forum it would outweigh that rule and incentivise action.
The same could be said with this behavior. The forums are already on their last leg, and if you want to enable their demise by accepting this behavior go ahead. Just know it will be on your conscience and you will be held accountable for it in the end.
You realize this post is almost 3 years old right? Why are you searching old posts like this and responding like they're still relevant. At the time of this post the game either had just come out on stream or hadn't been released on steam yet. If you're just looking to troll and necro until you get banned, good luck. No one appreciates the forums getting buried in ancient posts to the point its hard to find new ones.
Thank you for your response Spoon. Those are certainly some of the most heart breaking lives. When you're invested in a lineage and everything is stacked against you. It feels terrible but it also shines a light on how countless people must have felt in our species past. Not saying its good mechanics but that anguish and heartache is something interesting to reflect on and a major part of what attracted me to this game. That being said games are rarely built upon making you feel bad. In fact they are mostly built of feeling the opposite. An escape from reality where you can feel fulfillment. I would say thats a major factor in terms of what this game is lacking. We all want to make a difference for each other. That includes people who grief though it be oriented negatively. Making a difference is no small task but i find in the games current state its too inaccessible, especially during a surge. Balancing the good with the bad and making things healthy in terms of effort to results would go a long way. Especially when countering opposition. Its not a matter of fencing or maintaining an "in" crowd but giving the players a platform to preform in the opposition of those who would choose to damage their effort. Too much weight has been placed on outside resources to bolster the lighter sides of the game. Stuff like phex and the discord which maintain a balance and diminish overall communication and learning through raw gameplay. Those elements could be easily bolstered by simple adjustments in the games structure and i hope we see them experimented with soon. So much effort has been poured into the game and its about time we saw some effort to support those individuals who pour themselves into it. Most anger and stress we see that is evaluated as a toxic community is just people who are trying their hardest to make a difference despite overwhelming adversity. Its about time we gave them a break and give them an opportunity to thrive along side old and new players.